I suspect some devices keep trying to route through the dead node. Running repairs or letting the network heal itself should settle it down. That's why I was asking for the route change info to see if my theory is correct.
I'll take a look a again tonight and even try to get a better screenshot... Yeah I think you are right with the maximum number which caused the scrolling to stop...
Update... Still haven't heard anything from @bobbyD or @gopher.ny so I'm guessing they must be buried in the next platform update.
I ran the hub for well over 24 hours and also went through and tested every z-wave device on my mesh. I even re-configured all of them, making sure drivers were correct and that they were reachable... After 24 hours, the highest route change was 5 and that was my smoke detectors. All the switches, outlets and everything else maxed out at 3. I'm not posting a new table because I tried shutting the hub down again to see if I could add the z-stick.... Nope... Still nothing...
I'm getting this error when I try to add it... And this happens well before the countdown timer stops...
Z-Wave Inclusion timed out, status:7
So I'm pretty much out of ideas... Should I start a help ticket or just wait until they weigh in?
1 Like
One more update... SUCCESS!!!
The ghost that had routing info was for sure an outlet that had failed and I had removed from power... But it was the main issue with holding everything else up...
I took a chance and wired it back up... to my surprise, it wasn't doing the clicking sound and acted as if it was working...
I went back into z-wave settings and focused on the ghost... I hit the "discover" button while at the same time clicking on the outlet button... wham! it recognized it and added it back into my system as a generic z-wave outlet! Basically it restored to right where the hub thought it should be!
I had some issues removing it, getting network busy errors, but finally shut the hub down and pulled the plug for a minute... When I fired it back up, I was able to successfully removed that outlet...
Now I still have the remaining ghost with no routing info next to it and it didn't want to remove after all this, so I'm going to let everything settle for a bit and try in the morning... Maybe now I can add my z-stick in and do it that way...
Either way, I got that crazy node out! Now unfortunately, most of my ghosts are indeed caused by failed GE devices... This one acted like it had failed with the rest and is why I removed it to begin with...
Anyway, thank you to everyone for their help and suggestions! I appreciate all of you!
2 Likes
So... it sounds like removing that node did not actually change anything except that one node is now removed?
1 Like
Excellent! Your patience is being rewarded by the cosmos. 
Smart move to shut down the hub to help w/the removal process.
Good idea.
Only ones that failed for me are that "bad batch" of the old non-plus Z-Wave stuff, never had an issue w/outlets or newer Z-Wave Plus switches/dimmers.
Good to have some good news.
@jtp10181
Yeah, I thought that one was possibly causing the problems with me being able to include and exclude devices including the z-wave stick.
Tried removing the other ghost this morning and no dice... Also tried adding in the z-stick and no dice with that either... I'll play with it when I get home later today...
I'm really just hung up that its most likely the ghosts causing my issues... At least I got one down... And that one claimed to have been still routing so it needed to go...
The last one doesn't have any routing info and looks like a regular ghost.
@danabw
All of my GE/Jasco failures have been z-wave plus, but the first gen plus models... I was a huge Lowes IRIS user and had all original z-wave stuff before upgrading to all plus between 2016 and 2018... I've had switches and outlets from all of those years fail and in large quantity... Call me a gluten for punishment but I have replaced the failed ones with the newer Enbrighten switches and they seem ok so far... I like to stick with one brand.
I was told the problems were specific to a certain lot, but my experience has been otherwise...
anyway, tonight I'll try to get rid of that last ghost and see how things fare.
1 Like
I’m not convinced. Maybe in the short term but it should not be a problem for very long.
When you are trying to pair the usb stick, are you using classic pairing mode (not nwi)? Also click the shield and disable all the security.
Is the only remaining problem just pairing the usb stick? Or other device problems still?
yeah, you might be right on your theory....
i've tried pairing it both in classic and nwi. and i'm still seeing a lot of network related issues in terms of slowness and nodes not receiving commands... all of that was good before the failures and subsequent ghosts and its been two weeks since I put in the new devices... if its not the ghosts, then I think there are some issues with this stack.
I can tell you I had the antenna mod on my C7's and had way better connections and responsiveness with that hub. I updated primarily because I'm looking forward to some of the ZW long range devices coming.
BTW, I do have a setup for doing zniffer, but have no idea what i'd be looking at... I set up a separate stick for that about two years ago. I might open that up and see if I can figure it out.
Did you disable the security in PC controller before trying to pair?
Also, if you are using a POE splitter on your hub try switching to a regular power supply temporarily. There has been issues with some POE setups on the C8
For zsniffer, if you just capture a bunch of data and send it to me I can take a peek.
no POE and security disabled... this morning it partially included on the PC Controller side but never finessed and showed nothing on the hub side..
I don’t know that I have tried doing no security on the stick but thought maybe it would speed it up. Maybe try doing it with security if you have not? I always do mine with s2 so I can do firmware updates on s2 paired devices.
If you want to just capture a bunch of sniffer logs I could take a look at them. I have all your node info from up above.
And actually I have been wanting to see some sniffer logs from a failed node removal as well!
I'll try to get that up and running... I know there is a thread on it from a few years ago...
I remember that the zniffer has to be near or between the devices you are trying to capture data from... let me see what I can produce for ya...
even if my other issues resolve, now that you are dabbling in setting routing, I want to have it running to possibly play with that as well...
Yeah I was thinking about making a guide post for that. It seems to be working ok. The one device I tried to force a route with a single hop keeps going back to direct still but at least it has this other route as a permanent option now. That device seems to be responding better than before.
2 Likes
Definitely would help to have info (and cautions) about using that capability. I am worried we'll have folks doing stuff w/it that will cause more issues in some cases, unintended consequences and all that.
Have you noticed any of the bouncy behavior you were worried about on the route changes? Or are you saying it's bouncing but still working well?
Looks like maybe a few extra route changes but these 3 devices have always been some of the worst offenders for changes anyway. Seems like actually less changes than usual since I added the route. So far so good. Seems hard to do too much damage, if the route you force is terrible it will just fall back to one of the other routes anyway. Just might cause a slight delay at times while it sorts it out.
2 Likes
I hope you get a chance to share your steps. I have some outside devices I would love to try this with.
If I could have routed my kids when they were small...
- School>Trash Cans at Curb>Side of house>Dinner Table>Bedroom Desk Homework>Bed
Ahhh, bliss. 
1 Like
Just a quick update for everyone...
I tried everything to get rid of that last ghost including trying to fix the bad switch that caused it... I ordered capacitors and tried my hand at taking it apart and soldering the new part on. Needless to say, it didn't work.. (I'm a crappy solderer) and I couldn't get the switch to come back to life.
Many different tries to get the Z-Stick paired also failed and I resolved to just have a permanent ghost. By the way, I tried all kinds of things to pair the stick including setting the hub and the stick right next to each other, removing security and standing on one leg.
Ever since upgrading to the C8, I have noticed my coverage was not as good as on the C7. Many devices outside the house have not been responding timely... I had previously done the @lewis.heidrick antenna mod on my C7's and figured I'd try putting the L-com antenna on my Hub to see if it improved anything...
Right-a-way, I was able to reach my outside devices... Then, for no reason except I like to torment myself, I tried adding the Z-Wave USB stick again... Normal settings, in separate rooms and with security...
INSTANTLY, the stick paired to the hub! I was then able to use PC Controller to easily remove my last remaining ghost.
So after weeks, trying everything in the book, and one last hail Mary shot, it appears my inclusion issues might have had something to do with the antenna?
Maybe the problems some others are reporting with z-wave have to do with the antenna?
And Jeff, I even setup the Zniffer and was trying to capture the pairing with the stick a few days ago, but of course no dice... Tonight, I didn't have it going... Sorry...
3 Likes
There have been some reports of bad antennas. Others having no issues have swapped the antenna for no noticeable difference. So with your improvements using the replacement antenna I would say your original one was likely defective. Only other explanation would be the L-com antenna should have a flatter and wider coverage area, so for a single story home that antenna would give you better range with the trade off of slightly worse coverage above and below the plane of the hub.
Might be interesting to know if you put the OTHER stock antenna on there to see if that works. Its unlikely BOTH are defective, but also possibly neither are and you just needed that flatter wider coverage area.
2 Likes
