Home Assistant or Hubitat or both?

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41

You seem to like RL and that's fine. You compare RL to Scripts in HA, but I was talking about Scenes. Scenes don't have a YAML interface (at least I didn't see one)
Most automations can be done with a graphical interface, but some more complex features need access to YAML. You have a steeper learning curve for Home Assistant, but it took me also about 2 months before I was able to write my first dynamic lighting rule in HE. More power and control also means more learning. I got nearly crazy to migrate this rule to HA even having the HE Rule as blueprint. 95% were possible in the graphical interface but getting out the values of “Helpers” (HA global variables) required hard coding and much searching in the forum. Once found and understood it is a copy paste for future cases. Here is the YAML code for this automation done mainly in the graphical editor :

alias: office_play_colorrotation
description: Rotate colors of the two hue play lights
trigger:
  - platform: state
    entity_id:
      - input_boolean.office_switch_playcolorrotation_virtual
    to: "on"
    enabled: false
condition: []
action:
  - service: input_number.set_value
    data:
      value: 0
    target:
      entity_id:
        - input_number.var_office_play01_color
  - service: input_number.set_value
    data:
      value: 180
    target:
      entity_id: input_number.var_office_play02_color
  - repeat:
      sequence:
        - if:
            - condition: numeric_state
              entity_id: input_number.var_office_play01_color
              above: 359
          then:
            - service: input_number.set_value
              data:
                value: 0
              target:
                entity_id: input_number.var_office_play01_color
          else:
            - service: input_number.increment
              data: {}
              target:
                entity_id: input_number.var_office_play01_color
        - if:
            - condition: numeric_state
              entity_id: input_number.var_office_play02_color
              above: 359
          then:
            - service: input_number.set_value
              data:
                value: 0
              target:
                entity_id: input_number.var_office_play02_color
          else:
            - service: input_number.increment
              data: {}
              target:
                entity_id: input_number.var_office_play02_color
        - delay:
            hours: 0
            minutes: 0
            seconds: "{{ states('input_number.var_office_Play_SwitchTime') | int }}"
            milliseconds: 0
        - service: light.turn_on
          data:
            hs_color: "{{ states('input_number.var_office_play01_color') | int }},100"
          target:
            entity_id: light.office_light_hueplay01
        - service: light.turn_on
          data:
            hs_color: "{{ states('input_number.var_office_play02_color') | int }},100"
          target:
            entity_id:
              - light.office_light_hueplay02
      while:
        - condition: state
          entity_id: input_boolean.office_switch_playcolorrotation_virtual
          state: "on"
  - service: light.turn_off
    data: {}
    target:
      entity_id:
        - light.office_light_hueplay01
        - light.office_light_hueplay02
mode: single

The fact that you CAN do automations by writing true code like a developer is a huge advantage for developers (no access behind the interface on HE).

42

You can write apps for Hubitat...

(These apps are more comparable to something like AppDaemon on Home Assistant, IMHO [not really part of the platform but a popular enough third-party tool, or at least it was the last time I used Home Assistant for automation], than it is with anything built-in -- so a bit more complex than a YAML or GUI automation, but also as powerful as anything you can do in Rule Machine or any app, all of which are essentially just this but built-in to the platform.)

3 Likes
43

This templating is hard for beginners and that is the part I had to go to YAML. Once you realize that this simply means to assess the state of your entity and use it as an integer value in the automation its easy.

44

I agree, but that's another even steeper learning curve. For me YAML in automations is just a higher access level to "Rule Machine" in HA. I admit that the nice graphical interface of HA is still missing some features where you have to go even to YAML to do things you can actually do in RM, but you can also go much deeper. And objectively the interface of automations is up to date, nice and easy to use and can't in no way be compared to the clunky windows 3.1 interface of RM. I remember the many times I was unable to change a line in RM and finally deleted the line and created it again from scratch.

1 Like
45

For those who never touched the latest version of HA, this is what one block of my automation is looking like :

image
image1828×848 50.7 KB

and this is what a YAML block can be in the graphical interface :
image
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You don't need to go to the text editor like interface to do YAML. I could simply write 180,100 in this field to set the HUE to 180 and brightness to 100. But as I want to use the value of a "Helper" I have to extract one of the many possible state values and hand it over as an integer number. This is the hard part, but in comparison of a global variable in HE i could extract states as string or the date and hour of the last change or the creation and so on.

1 Like
46

Ah, I see. Are you using AlexxIT's XiaomiGateway3 integration for that?

47

Global variable (HE) vs. Helper (HA) :

A global variable in HE is just a value, it's easy to use and that's fine for lambda users.

A number helper is an entity (nearly like a device) and contains a value but has the following properties :

  • Minimum value
  • Maximum value
  • Name
  • Initial value
  • step (for incrementation)
  • mode (for dashboard usage - field or slider)
  • unit (for representation - °C, sec, or anything you want)
  • icon (for representation)
    It has the following built in services (commands)
  • decrement
  • increment
  • reload
  • set_value
    There are other helpers for booleans and many other types. They share all common properties like internal id, date of creation, last modification, context, attributes and much more. You see that they are variables, but far more and that makes HA more complex and complicated, but gives you also all this power if you are willing to learn and invest your time.

Final word : If you are happy with HE, and HE is a nice platform, and don't want to learn code and more to go further, stay with HE. Maybe I will at some point see that HA is much to hard to learn I will stay with HE who is better than most other alternatives out there.

Just a test dashboard example with my 3 variables exposed so you see what unit and mode are good for.

image
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48

I dunno, here's a simple scene I made for my wife... I can make them as simple or as complicated either using this or Room Lighting

image
image3505×1780 304 KB

49

There's nothing stopping people from writing a driver in HE (which you could think of as a Helper) that could do all of that. I might even look at doing some of those in some of my drivers like EcoWitt (specifically the min/max that has been requested already) or my Generic Attribute Driver.

50

I have a QNAP NAS and could easily spin up a HA container, just haven't found the time to do so. Curious for those of you using both HE and HA, what are you using HA for? In other words what am I missing out on?

I use Ecobee thermostats is the integration better there as an example?

51

@bob : Also ordered a Green hub and will do the same as you, try, learn and see.

1 Like
52

I have a qnap that I run HA on just for giggles. Honestly it really doesn't do much for me. I mean even with HADB installed, there isn't really that much for me to bring in. I thought it would do ok with my Litter Robot and Roborock but the information I can get from those I really don't need in Hubitat.... Just about everything I do is in hubitat from simple rules to complex ones. Simple and complex scenes. The dashboard is ok but I don't really use dashboards. I also don't want to write complex scripts to do something when it's all available to me in hubitat. I'm not knocking HA... I'm just saying I really don't find it better than Hubitat. As to the interface, sure Hubitat has a ways to go but I do most work on a pc when it comes to either hubitat or HA. I have the phone app simply to look at lock status' and hvac temp. Of course as with anything, YMMV...

1 Like
53

Connecting odd IP integrations from Home Assistant to Hubitat. It works well. Some others go the other way, largely for dashboards. I've even got a bit of a Frankenstein mode: I've got a couple items going Hubitat→Home Assistant→Control4.

You are better off setting up a VM as compared to a Docker container as the VM has HA add-ons, which are useful.

1 Like
54

Do you have any rules controlling Ecobee? HA does have local control of Ecobee thermostats because it can mimic a HomeKit Hub.

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55

Most of my response was actually regarding scenes. While HA has the ability to include more devices directly, native HA scenes don't have state, it's not possible to see scene settings at a glance, and editing a scene changes the actual state of devices.

56

Really dependant on your needs and desires. For me it started with a desire to use the Xiaomi motion sensors and contact sensors I owned. Once I learned that they are just as stable on HA as they are on a Xiaomi gateway, I bought more at a really good price from another community member that wanted to get rid of them.

I later switched from ZHA to Z2M and the number of possible Zigbee devices and features of each that could be accessed expanded immensely. I started experimenting with adding other devices that had previously been problematic, difficult, or impossible to reliably connect directly with Hubitat, such as IKEA devices, Lutron Connected Bulb Remotes, and those prevously PITA Gen1 OSRAM Garden Spots, which now work perfectly with Z2M.

Everthing is brought back to HE for Automation via Home Assistant Device Bridge. I have a few automations on HA, but they exist primarily to get around stateless devices that don't create entities, so I instead automate button presses on HA with virtual switches on HE so I can use them in HE automations.

I also use integrations for my:

  • Hyndai Ioniq 5 (Warm the car via Alexa, Lock the doors, ensure we have enough charge, check the EV battery via Pico button press at any of my Sinope themostats, and confirm the 12v battery level in the Apple Home app on our phones)
  • Moen Flo (There's an HE integration which I also use, but there's one additional way I use it that just works better for me on HA)
  • HomeKit Device (formerly HomeKit Controller) for my Aqara FP2
  • Oral-B toothbrush (so I can confirm the kid really brushed his teeth properly)
  • Philips Hue (gives instant feedback and supports access to motion sensors joined to the Hue Bridge)
  • Sense Home Energy Monitor (supports emulated Kasa plugs so I can bring the readings of devices that already have energy monitoring, as well as the readings from my Aeon HEMs into Sense)
  • Sonos (allows me to use my IKEA Symfonisk Sound Controller with Sonos, without the stability problems I had with that device on HE)
  • Xiaomi Miot Auto (Brings my Qingping AQM Pro into HA, and thus HE and Homebridge too)
  • Orbit B-Hyve (allows me to use my Misol soil moisture sensors to work with the Smart Watering feature of my B-Hyve hose valves)
  • Insteon (Although I don't use this for integration to Hubitat, I do use it to adjust Insteon device specific options, and to add new Insteon devices without needing to subscribe to the now, pay-for-use Insteon app)
  • MQTT (serves both the Z2M integration, and two D1 Mini EPS32 boards that are flashed to give direct local integration of multiple Switchbot devices with HA, and thus use them in HE automations)
1 Like
57

Maybe, but a helper is set up in 10 seconds on HA with a graphical interface.

59

Yes, that's the way it is intended to work and that's fine for me as I can see everything working or not. I could do a script in some minutes doing the same thing, and then I could see settings, but I have no utility for it.

60

Editing a scene in HA and it actually changing the state while editing is one of the most infuriating design decisions I've ever seen.

Want to tweak your goodnight scene? Well, prepare for all of your lights to shut off and your doors to lock because you can't edit it without activating it...

Really flipping dumb.

7 Likes
61

It's your right to have your opinion and preferences. I find it genius. With RL, I can edit scenes, but I have to activate them to see them in action, go back to change values like dimming, maybe colour, try again and again. Possibly my bulb is a little out of the standard and red is more like orange and so on, and I have to try it out. That is flipping dumb for me. In HA, I see every setting as I set up my scene and if the door closes it closes, after saving the scene it opens again. The hand full of scenes I have set up until now are fine, and I don't feel a need to go back on them again. The setup period will not affect my life :wink: