Help me fix my Zigbee network

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1

I'm starting a new thread about this here in the hopes that this might help other users with similar problems related to their Zigbee meshes. This is a continuation of a thread in which @aaiyar, @brad5 , @marktheknife , @ogiewon , @Tony had all contributed helpful advice, hence I am tagging them.

The problem: I have 4/7 of the Tuya AM 43 Blinds Drives using the @amosyuen's Zemismart Zigbee blinds driver which do not give correct status updates (open when opened, closed when closed, etc) to my respective dashboards. For lack of a better explanation, I am beginning to suspect that the problem is with my Zigbee network. Also, I have problems with Z-wave light switches in my first floor bathroom failing to be triggered by Zigbee motion sensors which could be related to this, though I'm beginning to suspect the latter problem is with the Z-wave network (separate thread on that to follow).

What I have: (Sorry if this is too much information, I just want to be as complete as possible in case it matters)

  • 2-story, approximately 4400 square foot house

  • Hubitat Elevation C-5 (purchased 5/7/2020) sitting on the second floor next to my network home run, albeit in an open area that overlooks the first floor

  • Hubitat is currently running the following Apps: Amazon Echo Skill, Basic Rules, 4 instances of CoCoHue, Echo Speaks (configuration not complete), Groups and Scenes, Hubigraphs (two instances), Hubitat Package Manager, Hubitat Dashboard, Hubitat Safety Monitor, 4 instances of Hue Bridge Integration, Lock Code Manager, Lutron Integrator, MyQ Lite, Notifications, Rachio Integration, Rules Machine Legacy, Simple Automation Rules, Thermostat Schedule (not currently used)

  • 1 Lutron Caseta L-BDGPRO2-WH - SmartBridge Pro - also sitting next to my Hubitat Elevation

  • 4 Philips Hue Bridges ‎(I believe all are model #458471) - also sitting next to my Hubitat Elevation

  • 3 SONOFF S31 Lite Zigbee Smart Plugs (US Type, confirmed work as Zigbee range extenders)

  • 4 LUNTAK Smart Plugs (LUNTAK Zigbee Switch,10A Zigbee Outlet Repeater Works as a Range Extender)

  • 4 Aeotec Z-wave Range Extender 6's

  • 3 Aeotec Z-wave Range Extender 7's

  • 11 Iris Motion Sensor IL07 3rd Generation Works with SmartThings & Zigbee

  • 1 Tuya Repeater

  • 9 Tuya AM43 Blinds Drives (Zigbee)

  • 10 Philips Hue light strips (Philips Hue 800276 WCA Plus Lightstrip)

  • 1 Philips Hue light strip ( Philips Hue ‎555334 Bluetooth Smart Lightstrip Plus)

  • 12 Philips Hue A-19 LED smart color bulbs

  • 3 Philips Hue ceiling downlights (Philips Hue White & Color Ambiance Smart Retrofit Recessed Downlight 5/6", Bluetooth & Zigbee Compatible (Hue Hub Optional), Smart Ceiling Lighting)

  • 4 Philips Hue color lamps (Philips Hue Go White and Color Portable Dimmable LED (Bluetooth & Zigbee) Smart Light Table Lamp)

  • 1 Philips Hue White & Color Amarant Outdoor Light Bar Extension, 80-Watt/1600 Lumen,

  • 2 Philips Hue Tap Smart Light Switches

  • 40 Leviton Z-wave Plus Switches (Leviton DZ15S Decora Smart Switch with Z-Wave Technology) [2 currently not paired]

  • 7 Leviton Z-wave Switches (Leviton DZS15-1LZ Decora Switch, Z-Wave, 15-Amp, Scene Capable)

  • 5 Leviton Paired Switches for the above in 2-way and 3-way circuits (DD0SR-DLZ Dual Voltage 120/277VAC, 60Hz Decora Companion Switch for multi-location control)

  • 7 Leviton Smart Plugs (Leviton DZPA1-2BW Decora Smart Plug-in Outlet with Z-Wave Technology, White, Repeater/Range Extender)

  • 2 GE Z-wave outdoor Z-wave plus timer plugs (GE 14284 Enbrighten Z-Wave Plus Smart Outdoor Switch, 1-Outlet Plug-In, Weather-Resistant, Works with Alexa, Google Assistant, for Landscape & Seasonal Lighting. Hub Required, Black)

  • 7 Leviton Z-wave fan controls (Leviton VRF01-1LZ Vizia RF + 1.5A Scene Capable Quiet Fan Speed Control)

  • 3 Lutron Caseta Dimmer Switches with pico remote controls (Lutron Caseta Wireless Smart Lighting Dimmer Switch and Remote Kit for Wall & Ceiling Lights, P-PKG1W-WH)

  • 1 Lutron Caseta fan control (Lutron Caseta Smart Home Ceiling Fan Speed Control Switch PD-FSQN-LA )

  • 5 MustWin Smart Retrofit LED Recessed Lighting 6 inch LED Downlights, Bluetooth Mesh LED Smart Can Lights Color (Connected to Alexa via its Bluetooth transmitter and the appropriate Alexa skill, and using virtual switches in Hubitat via Alexa)

  • 1 Ring Video Doorbell Pro – Upgraded (I think this is Ring Video Doorbell Pro 2, purchased 11/11/2018)

  • 1 Ring Stick Up Cam Plug-In HD security camera with two-way talk

  • 8 Meross Wi-Fi Smart Plug Mini, 15 Amp

  • 1 Amazon Echo Show 10 (3rd generation)

  • 1 Amazon Echo Show 10 (1st or 2nd generation)

  • 2 Amazon Echo Spot devices

  • 4 Amazon Echo dot devices (3rd generation)

  • 3 Amazon Echo dot devices (2nd generation)

  • 1 Echo Auto device

What I have tried: (follows in next posting)

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Output of /hub/zigbee/getChildAndRouteInfo shows me the following information. I understand that I want to get my LQI for each device to around 250, and that I want the inCost and outCost values to be as low as possible but not zero. Some of these repeaters I can move because, even though they are smart plugs, I primarily got them to function as repeaters. However others (Master Bedroom Diffuser, Holiday Lites Dining Room, Master Bathroom Diffuser, Game Room Table Light, Holiday Lites, Temple) have to be where they are because they control devices that need to be there. Other problems - only one device is showing up under Child Data, though I would expect to see my other 10 Iris Zigbee sensors to show up here. Is this indicative of a problem?

Parent child parameters
EzspGetParentChildParametersResponse [childCount=1, parentEui64=0000000000000000, parentNodeId=65535]

Child Data
child:[Kids Bathroom Sensor, 70D2, type:EMBER_SLEEPY_END_DEVICE]

Neighbor Table Entry
[Theater Room Zigbee Plug, 1F6F], LQI:254, age:6, inCost:1, outCost:7
[Tuya Zigbee Repeater, 3FDA], LQI:249, age:4, inCost:3, outCost:1
[Living Room Zigbee Outlet, 5597], LQI:254, age:4, inCost:1, outCost:5
[Master Bedroom Diffuser, 78E4], LQI:241, age:5, inCost:5, outCost:7
[Holiday Lites Dining Room, 9A89], LQI:254, age:4, inCost:1, outCost:1
[Foyer Zigbee Plug, A245], LQI:237, age:6, inCost:5, outCost:7
[Master Bathroom Diffuser, AAC4], LQI:54, age:7, inCost:7, outCost:0
[Game Room Table Light, C73B], LQI:252, age:6, inCost:3, outCost:1
[Holiday Lites Temple, CA89], LQI:30, age:7, inCost:7, outCost:0
[Study Room Zigbee Plug, F430], LQI:38, age:7, inCost:7, outCost:0

Route Table Entry
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Master Bathroom Diffuser, AAC4] via [Tuya Zigbee Repeater, 3FDA]
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Kitchenette Sensor, C896] via [Holiday Lites Dining Room, 9A89]
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Holiday Lites Temple, CA89] via [Holiday Lites Dining Room, 9A89]
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Dining Room Blinds 2, EB5E] via [Game Room Table Light, C73B]
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Master Bedroom Diffuser, 78E4] via [Master Bedroom Diffuser, 78E4]
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Master Bathroom Sensor, 7FBB] via [Tuya Zigbee Repeater, 3FDA]
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Garage Sensor, 4A46] via [Game Room Table Light, C73B]
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Master Closet Sensor, 0323] via [Tuya Zigbee Repeater, 3FDA]
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Play Room Sensor, 7C4E] via [Tuya Zigbee Repeater, 3FDA]
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Living Room Zigbee Outlet, 5597] via [Tuya Zigbee Repeater, 3FDA]
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Kids Bedroom Sensor, C33B] via [Tuya Zigbee Repeater, 3FDA]
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Master Commode Sensor, 4CD3] via [Tuya Zigbee Repeater, 3FDA]
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Game Room Table Light, C73B] via [Game Room Table Light, C73B]
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Utility Room Sensor, 29EB] via [Tuya Zigbee Repeater, 3FDA]
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Master Shower Sensor, 715A] via [Tuya Zigbee Repeater, 3FDA]
status:Active, age:32, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Holiday Lites Dining Room, 9A89] via [Tuya Zigbee Repeater, 3FDA]

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Okay, so let's start with a few questions... Why do you have 4 Philips Hue bridges for ~33 Hue devices? One Hue bridge should be able to handle all of those devices.

Why do you have both CoCoHue and the Hubitat Hue Bridge integrations running? You should only use one or the other, I believe. And if you can consolidate down to one Hue bridge, you'd only need one instance of either CoCoHue or the Hubitat Hue Bridge integratoion, thus reducing from 8 apps down to one.

What Zigbee channel(s) are those 4 Hue bridges and the Hubitat Hub using? Hue only allows the use of 11, 15, 20, and 25 I believe. Thus, with 4 Hue bridges, it sounds like you may have some conflicting Zigbee networks. By removing 3 of the Hue bridges, you'll free up some frequency spectrum for the Hubitat Hub to use one of these three Zigbee channels as well. 15, 20, and 25 are the three best Zigbee channels, as they conflict the least with 2.4GHz WiFi channels 1, 6, and 11. (Hint: Make sure your 2.4GHz WiFi is only using channels 1, 6, and/or 11, and only at 20MHz frequency width.)

Only Zigbee devices that are directly connected to the Hubitat hub will show up as a Child Device. Your other Zigbee sensors are connecting via your Zigbee outlets which are acting as Zigbee repeaters.

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@Krishna,

I agree with everything that @ogiewon has written. I have two zigbee networks running concurrently - one on channel 15 and one on channel 25. They don't seem to interfere with each other (and there's apparently very little WiFi interference as well). But with 5 zigbee networks, the odds are high that you have interference.

My Hue bridge is packed in my attic, but memory says that channel 11 was also a choice.

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Thanks Ashok! I have updated my post above to include channel 11.

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Correct - one bridge should handle all of those Hue devices, but the bridge is extremely limiting when I want to add in scenes and formulas for all those devices. In order to get all the scene and formulas I wanted, I had to ultimately get 4 bridges, with each bridge controlling devices in two rooms.

I was told I believe by @bertabcd1234 the same thing, but what I discovered is that importing the devices in CoCoHue resulted in problems with controlling those devices. After much experimentation I discovered that importing the devices with the native Hue app and importing the scenes with CoCoHue was the best way to make it all work. I could possibly be the only person who reported this problem, and quite possibly there was some other problem that I failed to recognize. However, going back and deleting the devices and reimporting them via CoCoHue would be a lot of work I'd prefer to avoid if there isn't a really good reason.

Good question. Just FYI, my Philips Hue devices are mostly working fine, and I only added the 4th bridge about a week ago, before which I had the same problems with the Tuya 43 blinds drives.

But that being said, how do I find out what channels the Hue bridges are using? And is it possible for each bridge to use the same channel since they are basically the same?

Ahh, good, so that's not the problem then. Based on what you are saying, every other sensor is linked via the repeater. The Kids Bathroom sensor isn't because it's near by to the Hubitat. Though, there is a Kids Bedroom sensor that is also closer to the Hubitat, yet is not listed as a child device, so I guess that one is also going through a repeater for some reason?

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This seems like a somewhat excessive excessive use of Hue Scenes, IMHO. How many scenes do you have for these lights? I would recommend that one try and keep things as simple as possible, especially while things are not running in a stabile manner. Less is more in this scenario.

Again, this seems quite excessive to me. Running 8 Apps just to interface with ~33 lights is causing those Hue Hubs to get a lot of LAN traffic. Again, simpler is usually better.

In the Hue App on your mobile phone, select SETTINGS (bottom right), and then "Bridge Settings" to see the channel being used on each Hue Bridge.

Also, what Zigbee channel is your Hubitat Hub using? Settings (with "Show Advanced Options" enabled) -> Zigbee Details

They should each get their own Zigbee channel, IMHO. They will conflict with each other, and the Hubitat Hub's Zigbee channel, if you do not make sure they are all unique.

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Thanks. I checked - all four Philips bridges are using channel 25. They don't seem to be conflicting with each other.

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Please answer the same question regarding your Hubitat Hub's Zigbee channel...

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@Krishna

Honestly, I don’t see how you can avoid both zigbee and WiFi interference with 5 zigbee networks.

Can you replace any of your Hue scenes with Hubitat scenes?

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Hubitat is using Zigbee channel 20. So we have channel 25 for the Philips Hue bridges and 20 for Hubitat itself.

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Which WiFi channel(s) are you using?

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Okay, and what 2.4GHz WiFi channel(s) are being used on your home network?

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I concur. But if you're only using CoCoHue for scenes, one thing you can to do limit the amount of LAN traffic it uses it to disable polling (in CoCoHue) if you haven't already. If all you have are scenes, polling doesn't do much for you--it just updates the states of lights and groups (Hue doesn't track scene states, and without an associated group, there's no state for CoCoHue to infer for the scene device, which I only did per user requests/confusion). You can also use "manual" configuration rather than discovery for the Bridge in the app configuration, although that matters far less since it would only create traffic if it can't find the Bridge or when something else on the network sends an SSDP "discovery" that the Bridge (and the app) responds to.

Without that, you'll only get LAN activity--or really any at all--from CoCoHue when you activate a scene. Presumably, this would be not all that often. I'm assuming you have polling enabled on the Hubitat integration (if you use scenes or control devices from outside Hubitat, you pretty much need to if you care to have their state reflected accurately in Hubitat), which would account for the majority of LAN traffic on Hubitat from Hue.

Probably won't help with any of this, but a good idea regardless. :slight_smile: (And I'd actually be curious why the CoCoHue devices weren't working, as I've never encountered that problem before, but if what you have now works, then... :man_shrugging: )

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That's what I was trying to do at first before I discovered CoCoHue. What was happening is I would save the colors in a certain scene, and yet when I later activated that scene, I would get something completely different.

I know that there is an issue with the Hubitat - Hue bridge timing, something about it not updating right away, and I know I took that into account but it was still a problem that only CoCoHue allowed me to get around.

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OK, I disabled polling on all four instances of the CoCoHue App. Thanks for your feedback!

I had polling enabled at 1 minute before I disabled them in the CoCoHue App. I occasionally control the scenes using the Hue app, but now that I've created dashboards with all those scenes, I really don't need to and usually just use the dashboard.

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Let me get back to you on this. I forgot my Comcast Xfinity modem/router web interface password and need to figure out how to get back in there.

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Pretty much none of those are doing much to repeat. The LQI is bad on half of them. The other half are high incost/outcost. At LQI in the 30s to 50s, I am surprised they ever worked.

That Tuya repeater is about the only thing doing anything.

Between this, your Wifi, and probably neighbors Wifi, I feel like you have very little chance of having Hubitat Zigbee function correctly. You are literally drowning out the Hubitat Zigbee with all these 2.4Ghz networks in my opinion.

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So of those devices, only three have really low LQI - Master Bathroom Diffuser, Holiday Lites Temple and Study Room Zigbee Plug. The former two have to be where they are and are not needed to function as repeaters. I've heard that poorly functioning devices can bring down the Zigbee network but I don't know how to disable the repeater function on these smart plugs. The other one, Study Room Zigbee Plug, was added recently in an attempt to improve my Zigbee network. I could easily move it anywhere, it's not connected to anything.

Another member told me he bought Zigbee plugs to put in every room to make sure his Zigbee network was functioning correctly. That's why I bought some of these extra smart plugs. But I'm not sure if it's truly a case of "more is more" or "less is more" since another member told me that low LQI and high InCost/OutCost could bring down the network.

Hmm. I'll keep this mind. But really, right now the only consistent problem is the failure to read the correct open/close state on my Tuya Zigbee blinds motors. All the other Zigbee devices including the smart plugs (the ones connected to devices I use) are turning on and off appropriately.

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Zigbee routing will avoid high cost paths (cost is derived from LQI) if a better one is available; they shouldn't bring down your network but certainly won't help it.

It's often said that 'you can't have too many repeaters' but this advice really doesn't apply to Zigbee. More than an adequate number (enough to provide coverage, adapt to changes in the RF environment, and if desired, allow redundancy) just adds useless overhead in terms of link status traffic and neighbor table management due to the status exhanges that in-range Zigbee routers constantly do, even when there are no hub or sensor messages to be routed. In contrast, a Z-Wave repeater is silent unless there is actual message or repair traffic being sent.

It's a CSMA/CA protocol, so less housekeeping traffic means fewer collisions and retransmissions and ultimately less latency. Likely not worth worrying about in the typical home network, but large Zigbee commercial applications (like office lighting, where potentially hundreds of routers could be in range of each other) take pains to manage the number of mains-powered devices that are enabled for routing. At any rate, using more Zigbee repeaters than you need won't improve your network and might make it slightly worse.

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