Troubleshooting Zigbee repeaters

[markus]

Continuing the discussion from [Release] Xiaomi / Aqara / Opple Drivers NEW!:

Mesh troubleshooting is best to keep separate, so creating a new topic.

@Sebastien

I suspect it is because of the thermostats, but am not sure how I can confirm this...

Easiest would be to remove your thrermostats and see if you can get your mesh stable with only the IKEA Repeater, since I don't know how many end devices and how large an area etc I can't give more precise advice on whether one repeater is enough or if you would need more.

@Sebastien

Unfortunately, I have no Zigbee stick - I can only work with what Hubitat gives me

Without this, it is a matter of trial and error; removing devices and waiting to see if the mesh gets to be stable.

[Sebastien]

@markus

Easiest would be to remove your thrermostats

Should I just power them off, or are there other steps that need to be taken? I’m heading off to bed, so will do that now and see if it resolves anything by the morning.

That said, here’s some more information... I have approx 1000 square foot per floor (2 floors + basement), with the Hub pretty much in the center of the house. Some devices would have 1 floor/wall between them and the sensor, others would have more. I have a Leak Sensor in my downstairs bathroom that is very close to the window sensor in that same room. Had no issues with it even before adding any of the Thermostats or the IKEA repeater, so I assume I probably could do without repeaters...

Also, I learned of this Hubitat tool a few days ago...

Would it help?
Http://[HUBIP]/hub/zigbee/getChildAndRouteInfo

From the 1st Hub (Screenshot taken twice, the first time with the Xiaomi sensors unavailable, the second with re-discovering the Downstairs Window and Guest Room Window):

Text Capture

Parent child parameters
EzspGetParentChildParametersResponse [childCount=10, parentEui64=0000000000000000, parentNodeId=65535]

Child Data
child:[Main Entrance Sylvania Motion Sensor, 36CF, type:EMBER_SLEEPY_END_DEVICE]
child:[Dining Room Fujitsu Mini-Split Air Outlet, 2DD6, type:EMBER_SLEEPY_END_DEVICE]
No information for Child 2
No information for Child 3
No information for Child 4
No information for Child 5
child:[Master Bedroom Sébastien Closet Sensor, 55C2, type:EMBER_SLEEPY_END_DEVICE]
No information for Child 7
No information for Child 8
child:[Basement Stairs Motion Sensor, 8F7D, type:EMBER_SLEEPY_END_DEVICE]

Neighbor Table Entry
[Den Thermostat, 5312], LQI:244, age:3, inCost:5, outCost:1
[Dimitri Thermostat, 6DAE], LQI:247, age:4, inCost:3, outCost:2
[Basement Game Room Thermostat, 6E89], LQI:243, age:3, inCost:5, outCost:2
[Guest Room Small lamp Outlet Plug, 7FC6], LQI:255, age:4, inCost:1, outCost:5
[Basement IKEA Tradfri Repeater, A981], LQI:254, age:4, inCost:1, outCost:1
[Xavier Thermostat , AC48], LQI:247, age:3, inCost:3, outCost:2
[Master Bedroom Thermostat, C352], LQI:246, age:4, inCost:5, outCost:1
[Dining Room Thermostat, F0C7], LQI:244, age:3, inCost:5, outCost:1

Route Table Entry
status:Unused
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Garage Door Inside Motion Sensor, 4F1E] via [Xavier Thermostat , AC48]
status:In Discovery, age:0, routeRecordState:2, concentratorType:High Ram, [null, 0000] via [Master Bedroom Thermostat, C352]
status:Unused
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Solarium Motion Sensor, CF06] via [Basement IKEA Tradfri Repeater, A981]
status:Unused
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Family Room Motion Sensor, 1959] via [Xavier Thermostat , AC48]
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Xavier’s Room Motion Sensor, 2E95] via [Xavier Thermostat , AC48]
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Family Room Couch Motion Sensor, 2901] via [Guest Room Small lamp Outlet Plug, 7FC6]
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Master Bedroom High Motion Sensor, C09A] via [Xavier Thermostat , AC48]
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Downstairs Bathroom Motion Sensor, B71F] via [Dimitri Thermostat, 6DAE]
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Basement Closet Sensor, 5C9A] via [Basement IKEA Tradfri Repeater, A981]
status:Active, age:32, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Basement Storage Motion Sensor, 4E07] via [Dimitri Thermostat, 6DAE]
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Xavier Closet Door Sensor, FB69] via [Xavier Thermostat , AC48]
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Upstairs Hallway Motion Sensor, AD19] via [Xavier Thermostat , AC48]
status:Active, age:64, routeRecordState:0, concentratorType:None, [Downstairs Bathroom Washing Machine Leak Sensor, 87EB] via [Basement IKEA Tradfri Repeater, A981]

Screenshot

Screenshot (With Problematic devices - Have Window or Window Sensor in their names)

From the 2nd Hub (No issues):

Screenshot

[Sebastien]

When I run a refresh on the getChildAndRouteInfo, I notice that my problematic devices often appear/pop-up “In Discovery”... Is this information that can be used?

Oh, and I notice you are “King for a day!” Not sure what that means, but it sounds like a good thing! I feel like I should address you as “Your Highness”!

[pugazhendhi.m]

King for a day! everyday !!

[markus]

@Sebastien

Because I have 6 Thermostats and only one IKEA repeater, I’m thinking that it may be easier to remove the repeater...

The IKEA Repeater is a known working and well-behaved device, no need to remove that one.

@Sebastien

I have approx 1000 square foot per floor (2 floors + basement), with the Hub pretty much in the center of the house.

This would be too large an area for just one repeater to handle. You'd probably need more for a useful test.

@Sebastien

Leak Sensor in my downstairs bathroom that is very close to the window sensor in that same room.

The Leak sensors tend to work better than most other Aqara devices.

@Sebastien

Would it help?
Http://[HUBIP]/hub/zigbee/getChildAndRouteInfo

This helps partially, it's from the perspective of the hub and the routing table it is aware of.

@Sebastien

I notice that my problematic devices often appear/pop-up “In Discovery”... Is this information that can be used?

Yes, it could, I don't have experience using it though, but I'd love for someone to chime in on that.

@Sebastien

Oh, and I notice you are “King for a day!”

It's this topic. Got nominated a few days ago

@Sebastien

“Your Highness”!

lol

[Sebastien]

@markus

The Leak sensors tend to work better than most other Aqara devices.

I should have been more specific... it’s a Smart Things leak sensor... though I now have some from Aqara on order...

@markus

It's this topic . Got nominated a few days ago

That was an awesome read!!! Thanks for the link! You certainly deserve the title!

Back to the topic at hand... I had forced the re-discovery of one device last night, and this morning it is still connected. Since my Sinopé thermostats are all off right now (turned them off last night. as per your recommendation) I think we may have found the culprit(s).

Not sure if it makes a difference, but I am using this awesome driver from @kris2k2 for The thermostat:

@kris2k2

Here's my code:
https://github.com/kris2k2/hubitat/blob/master/drivers/kris2k2-Sinope-TH112XZB.groovy

Now I wonder... what next! Can the thermostats be made to behave? Can something be done so the sensors don’t get the booted off when the thermostats are around? Should I order a Zigbee stick? I have never properly debugged a networking issue before... Zigbee or otherwise...

I’m thinking I could turn on the thermostats that is at the end of the house opposite to the still connected sensor to see if it has an impact... would that be useful?

Update: I turned on one of my Sinopé Zigbee thermostats. Now to see what will happen. I had to re-sync 2 of my sensors and they routed through it. The others still seem to go directly to the hub. Will see what happens.

Note: I have found another IKEA Zigbee repeater that I had stashed away. I haven’t paired it to any of my hubs yet... I’m thinking that I will pair it to the second hub unless we can figure out a way for the Sinopé Thermostats not to boot out the sensors... Assuming that this is the issue which, to me, seems likely...

[Sebastien]

@markus

This would be too large an area for just one repeater to handle.

It seems evidence is proving you right. One thing odd though, I would have expected my IKEA plug to help me Re-connect one of my devices (it’s in the same room) but I wasn’t able to get it to reconnect at all. Spent 3-5 minutes trying over and over again - no luck.

Update 1: (All Sinopé thermostats still off)

1. I checked-up on this last window’s sensor again after a couple of hours, and it is back up and running! It doesn’t appear to be going through the IKEA plug though - it seems to have connected directly to the hub which is in the room below.
2. One of the window sensors that had been working since yesterday has now stopped working.
3. The 6 sensors on my 2nd hub are all still working - no issues.

Update 2: (After 1 Sinopé thermostat was activated)
3 of the 5 sensors I had re-activated following my previous update are offline again. Those 3 are the ones closest to the re-activated Thermostat.

That leads me to conclude that they reconnected to it and shortly afterwards got disconnected by it from the mesh.

I think that even if I add the Zigbee extender I found, sensors will occasionally connect to the Thermostat and be pulled out of the mesh.

Does anyone disagree with my conclusions? Any recommendations for moving forward? I’m out of ideas...

I’m thinking that there are 3 options here:

1. Fix the Sinopé thermostat in a way that will stop it from kicking out the Xiaomi devices from the mesh (would need help with this - I have no idea if and how this can be done... and I’m not sure if @kris2k2 is still active or would have interest in commenting on this...)
2. Fix the Xiaomi devices so that they will either not let themselves be disconnected or somehow reconnect on their own. (@markus, is this something that is is within the sphere of your amazingness?)
3. Give-up on adding the Xiaomi devices on this hub and connect them to the much friendlier mesh on my other Hub, along with the Zigbee extender. (This I can do, but will hold off for a bit in case I get some help with options 1 or 2, since this could help others in a similar situation down the line...)

[markus]

@Sebastien

I’m thinking that I will pair it to the second hub unless we can figure out a way for the Sinopé Thermostats not to boot out the sensors... Assuming that this is the issue which, to me, seems likely...

This is a very reasonable assumption based on what you have seen.

@Sebastien

Fix the Sinopé thermostat in a way that will stop it from kicking out the Xiaomi devices from the mesh

This is most likely not possible, there are no standard zigbee calls that can disable the routing through a repeating device. There could be device-specific calls, but that is not easy to discover unless you can find some documentation regarding that, either official or in the form of a driver written for some other platform.

@Sebastien

Fix the Xiaomi devices so that they will either not let themselves be disconnected or somehow reconnect on their own.

This is, probably, already done so far it can be done from a driver. It already makes device reconnect at times they would previously have stayed offline, but it doesn't solve all types of issues. I'm still trying to find additional ways, but at this point I'm not all that hopeful I will find anything more that can be done from a driver without direct control over the controller.

@Sebastien

Give-up on adding the Xiaomi devices on this hub and connect them to the much friendlier mesh on my other Hub, along with the Zigbee extender.

This is probably the way to go, separating devices in separate meshes is a very common solution.

You reasoned through this really well

[Sebastien]

@markus

You reasoned through this really well

Thanks! I’ll stat down that path. If ever you have a change that you think may impact this and want some assistance to test, let me know! I’ve got 4 more sensors on order and expect that I’ll only need 2, so will have some sparks for testing.

[kris2k2]

Interesting thread guys; just as I was looking at 4 of my Xiaomi Aqara sensors not reporting-in, and thinking that it was related to a recent power-outage that forced the zigbee mesh to change its topology (and promoting my Sinope thermostats as reachable nodes).

(and yes, I crossed this same problem a while back, to which I had re-paired my Xiaomi devices having the thermostats off)

I'll ask Sinope is there is not any Zigbee attribute that can be set (so far, they have been non-responsive), but I think the solution "might" be found in the ZCL (https://zigbeealliance.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/12/07-5123-06-zigbee-cluster-library-specification.pdf).

[Sebastien]

I've ended-up putting all my Xiaomi devices on a different Hub as they kept being kicked-off (or something...) by my Sinope thermostats. If Sinope gets back to you or if you find a fix for that, I would love to know about it!

[kris2k2]

Funny you've mentioned, because I just did that this-weekend too!