So there’s a definite line between on/off and fade functions for this device, then.
Ok. Thanks. So how do you prevent questions like this from taking up your support time in the future? Maybe when zero is entered in the box a pop-up could warn users that it “may not be supported by all devices”? Maybe force them to click “OK” so that they hopefully read that message?
Oh, replace support time by development time? Or, we all just learn and the next time someone pops up with this issue, the community just tells him forget it, won't work.
^.^ Also, now it’s documented in the forum and can be referred to easily.
1 Like
I’m sure you could find more than one use for that feature 
Community support is great, but I have to say it’s really nice to have staff chime in quite often. I know it’s a lot easier for you right now because your team is small and lean, but it’s all those little things that add up to the growing displeasure with SmartThings, that you rarely hear from staff members.
FWIW, I’ve just been testing dim/brighten sequences for my Sengled “Classic” (E11-G13) bulbs and can confirm these behaviors using the new Generic ZigBee Bulb driver (which is a vast improvement, by the way!):
| Starting State | Command Sent | Level | Delay | Bulb’s Behavior | Final state |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
off/on, level 0 |
Dimmer setLevel
|
100 |
(blank) | Fast ramp up to 100% | on, level 100 |
off/on, level 0 |
Dimmer setLevel
|
100 |
0 |
Faster ramp up to 100%* | on, level 100 |
off/on, level 0 |
Dimmer setLevel
|
100 |
> 1 |
Longer ramp up to 100% | on, level 100 |
off, level 100 |
Dimmer setLevel
|
100 |
any # | Immediately on at 100% | on, level 100 |
off, level 100 |
Switch on
|
N/A | N/A | Immediately on at 100% | on, level 100 |
on, level 100 |
Dimmer setLevel
|
0 |
(blank) | Fast dim down to 0% | on, level 0 |
on, level 100 |
Dimmer setLevel
|
0 |
0 |
Faster dim down to 0%* | on, level 0 |
on, level 100 |
Dimmer setLevel
|
0 |
> 1 |
Longer dim down to 0% | on, level 0 |
on, level 100 |
Switch off
|
N/A | N/A | Immediately off | off, level 0 |
*Note: With these two starting state / command combinations, the current level state displayed in the Edit Device page at the end of the fade wasn’t always correct. Clicking the Refresh command fixed this. Not a big deal, I think.
I don’t know what happens behind the scenes in the new device driver, but I was a little surprised that a delay (transition time) of 0 resulted in a faster ramp up / dimming down than when leaving it blank.
After going through testing of commands, I then did some tests of using a button trigger in Rule Machine and in the Button Controller App.
Although it was easy to set up a Button Controller or Trigger Rule to do a slow ramp up from off to 100% on a certain button press it is impossible to set up a slow dim down to 0% and switch off on a certain button press using the Button Controller app.
This is because in Button Controller a dim level of 0 seems to be ignored, and the Delayed off feature wouldn’t work for me (at least not with my Sengled bulbs). I even tried a delay of 60 seconds, and that didn’t work either.
On the other hand, in Rule Machine setting up actions of Set dimmers to level of 0 and fade of x seconds -plus- Control switches: Delayed Off with a delay longer than the dim fade time worked just great.
So perhaps there are some bugs in Button Controller with regards to setting dim level and the Delayed off time?
2 Likes
there's an internal timer that runs to fetch the level setting, it's based off the fade value, when the fade value is 0, we are requesting the level state immediately after sending the command, simple fix for that.
a transition time 0, really is 0, immediately on/off, when no value is supplied the fade rate defaults to 1 second.
I thought about adding a preference setting for the default fade, and now that you've found a bug on level refresh with a fade of 0, i likely will.
Nice test and report BTW!
I'm glad to get this feed back on this driver, it will become the base functional model for the while level replacement, as well as some tuning I want to do on the RGB and RGBW drivers.
4 Likes
So what about the apparent bug I am experiencing with the Button Controller App:
Should I e-mail support? Let somebody else know?
Can’t comment on button controller because I have not had time to get to it yet. I am using your workaround for dim to 1% then off after delay with my Sengled Element Plus bulbs. It works as smoothly as is possible with those bulbs.
It was determined that this is a device issue that has nothing to do with Rule Machine or Button Controller. Fade is a feature of the device, if it has it, not a software function.
This "feature" is there to pass a parameter to those devices that support fade. It's looking as if those are few and far between. Perhaps it would make more sense to remove the feature, than have everyone making false assumptions about what is or is not happening with their devices.
Could you put in a toggle and have either fade to 0 or fade to 1 and then toggle off, with a note about “if fade to 0 doesn’t work, enable this”?
No. This is all based on misunderstanding.
Have you attempted this with the device details page? That will tell you exactly what the device is doing.,
It doesn’t affect me, my caseta stuff doesn’t do dim timings, so it’s always dim to off on toggle, over 3 seconds. It was just a suggestion to limit the confusion for new users.
That would only ADD to their confusion. The feature is so misunderstood, better not to have it at all.
1 Like
Okay, so would dim to 1, then toggle, work for all devices?
I'm sorry but I think you have me confused with the original poster.
I am not making any false assumptions in this case, have no issues understanding the possible limitations or inabilities of some devices to accept the fade speed parameter, and in fact what I was calling an apparent bug in the Button Controller App has nothing to do with the fade speed parameter.
So I am not sure why, after spending a bunch of time testing a different Sengled model bulb that @SmartHomePrimer's, reporting its behavior observed in the Device Details Page, and also reporting some descrepancies I observed between Rule Machine and the Button Controller App, I'm being met with a threat to remove the fade speed parameter altogether. Especially since I'm not even complaining about it.
The two things I noticed that seemed not to be working in the Button Controller App (and I use the word "seemed" here, because I don't want to make any assumptions) are fade to 0 and Delayed OFF. And the fade speed parameter has nothing to do with either of these.
In the Button Controller App, I can just set up a button to fade a light to 0, leaving the fade speed parameter blank, and nothing happens on that button press. If I make an edit to change the fade to 1 or any other value, then it works correctly. Setting up an action in Rule Machine to fade a light to 0 works, however.
With delayed OFF, I just tried doing a bunch more tests in the Button Controller App, and neither delayed ON or delayed OFF appear to be working. This is without any other actions on the button press, so the only action is delayed ON/OFF. I tried values of milliseconds, seconds, and 1 minute just in case it was related to that unit. In all cases, the delayed ON/OFF didn't occur. In all my tests, it's working as expected in Rule Machine, however.
1 Like
First an foremost, I want to express my sincere appreciation to the Hubitat team and the developers on this forum that have been putting in very long hours and huge amounts of effort to support the betterment of this product and its growing user base.
For the record, I’m not complaining about the fade speed parameter, nor do I have a misunderstanding about the answer I was given. I’m fine with it. The Sengled Element Plus are unique in the industry because they are zigbee bulbs that can be dimmed with a conventional dimmer. They’re different and so react different. I’m good with that answer.
I’m not in favor of removing the fade speed parameter. It’s a very nice feature and I want to be able to use it with anything that will support it. However, it would be nice for those just learning Hubitat to have the fields labelled (Top=“Brightness Level”, Bottom=“Fade Time in Sec”) 
Just so there’s no confusion of what I reported originally vs the more complete testing that @veeceeoh did with different Sengled bulbs, let me reiterate…
With Sengled Element Plus bulbs, brightness level works down to 1% and fade time works with brightness settings of 1% and higher. However, these particular bulbs do not do anything if the brightness is set to 0, regardless of what the fade time is set to. It’s not that they turn off fast, they simply don’t turn off when a brightness of 0 is entered, unlike other zigbee bulbs in Hubitat. But they’re unique, and I get that. It’s fine if they don’t behave the way other bulbs do. Please don’t remove the fade feature because of one bulb type that behaves differently from any zigbee bulb, because it is different from any other zigbee bulb.
1 Like
Sorry for the misunderstanding. By "fade to 0" do you mean set dimmer to 0? Perhaps the word "fade" is the source of confusion, at least for me. There is no test in Button Controller on the value entered for setting a dimmer. If you specify setting a dimmer to 0, that value is passed to the driver. I cannot speak to what the driver does with 0. Some drivers may interpret 0 as off, others may not. This driver behavior can be determined using the device details page.
It would seem to be a setup error to specify a dimmer value of 0 for these bulbs if the desired outcome is to turn the bulb off.
1 Like
We are investigating this issue.
Update This bug is confirmed, identified, and fixed. Fix will be in the next release.
2 Likes
I'm sorry if I am confusing things by using incorrect terms. However, in the case of my Sengled Classic bulbs, as explained in my post with the table above, I have confirmed the behavior of the new Generic Zigbee Bulb driver when I send a Set Level command with a first number (level) of 0:
To make it absolutely clear about the discrepancy in behavior I've observed between the Button Controller App and Rule Machine, here are screenshots showing the action settings and the observed results:
Again, I don't want to make any assumptions, because perhaps I don't understand the differences between Rule Machine and the Button Controller App, but it seems that if Set these dimmers with To this level = 0 works with a specific device / bulb in Rule Machine, it should also work in the Button Controller App with that same device / bulb.
Not necessarily. I have seen plenty of videos of automated home theater setups where the lights dim slowly to no light before video is played. If that is my desired outcome, and I need to first send a Set Level command with level = 0 and a long "fade" delay value before a switch = off command to the dimmer or lights, I don't see any error in that, especially if the switch = off command alone results in the lights immediately turning off. Does that make sense?
