[Released] Rule 4.0


Hey Bruce, this is where I'm at - but would love to combine these into a single rule AND ensure all this works:

If the Guest Bathroom Fan or Master Bath Shower Light turn on the Hot Water should turn on for 20 minutes (does this now). If either of those turn on again - then reset the 20 minute timer (not sure how to do that part).

If The Dishwasher turns on then turn on The Hot Water for 150 minutes (almost does this, but if The Hot Water was already on, not sure if it will work right).

And if either The Hot Water or The Dishwasher turn of - turn them both off (this could be problematic if The Dishwasher is on (for 150 minutes) but the delay rule turns off The Hot Water before expected).

Here are my current (new) rules - not yet tested, but should be good starting point:





You have multiple simultaneous instances of that rule running at the same time. And, your Repeat will never stop the way you've done it. And, you put the END-REP in the wrong place. A real hot mess, that one.


OOPS - one obvious error I just noticed during testing... the OFF rule has wrong action (ON) and I changed that.


This is sort of a mess.

Tell me if this restatement is correct, or where it's wrong:

If Guest Fan or Master Light turn on, turn on Hot Water for 20 minutes; If during the 20 minutes they come on again, restart the 20 minute timer.

If the Dishwasher turns on, turn on Hot Water for 150 minutes. And, presumably, that 150 minutes should trump the first part from the bathrooms. If the dishwasher turns off before the 150 minutes are up, turn off the Hot Water.

Is this right?


Yep which is why I was asking about the error and not the rule logic. I keep asking for help in another thread Need help getting this RM 4 Rule to Cancel the Repeat and so far, nothing is working


That error is the warning that you have multiple simultaneous instances running, which is not allowed nor will it work.


One other question: With respect to the bathrooms, setting aside momentarily the dishwasher, why don't you just turn on the hot water when either comes on, and turn it off when they are both turned off? Why 20 minutes? If someone is in there for 30 minutes, why would you turn off the hot water?


Almost... Just need to add "If The Hot Water or Guest Fan or Master Light..." sometimes we turn it on directly and still want it to go off after 20 minutes.


So I think this is two rules, and two Global Variables. Create two GVs, below I'll call them DishHot and BathHot, both Booleans initialized to false. I've abbreviated Guest Bathroom Fan to Fan and Master Bath Shower Light to Light.

Rule 1

Trigger Events:  Fan, Light, Hot Water any On
   On: Hot Water
   Set BathHot to true
   Cancel Delay
   Delay Actions 20:00 Cancel
   IF (DishHot = false) Off: Hot Water
   Set BathHot to false

Rule 2

Trigger Events: Dishwasher on
   Set DishHot to true
   On: Hot Water
   Wait for Events: Dishwasher off, Timeout 02:30:00 
   IF (BathHot = false) Off: Hot Water
   Set DishHot to false

How these two work: If any of Fan, Light or Hot water are turned on, turn on Hot Water, and then turn it off 20 minutes later, unless the Dish Washer is running; reset the 20 minute timer if any of those turn on during the 20 minutes. If the Dishwasher turns on, turn on the Hot Water for 2:30 unless the Dishwasher turns off first, and then turn off the Hot Water unless one of the bathrooms has turned it on for 20 minutes.


Those look perfect! Will create and test.

BTW, how do you get that view of rules? or are you just typing them that way?


Just typing and using the </> symbol at the top of the edit post window.


Two things, first, when you said Cancel Delay in Rule 1... I assume that equates to "Cancel Delayed Actions"? If not, where do I find it?

Second, if I manually turn off either The Hot Water or The Dishwasher I want both to turn off and cancel any timers. Right now if both are on and I turn either off the other stays on and if I manually turn off The Hot Water BathHot remains true.

My thought on the second one is to change the Delay Actions in Rule1 to be a Wait for Events like Rule2 maybe?



So if you turn off the Dishwasher, you want to turn off the Hot Water even though your wife just went in to take a shower? And, if you turn off the Hot Water you want that to turn off the Dishwasher too?

If you turn off the Hot Water, the timers become irrelevant, because all they're going to do is turn off something that is already off. So I don't think you need to worry about that case. Turning off the Dishwasher does turn off the Hot Water unless someone is in the bathroom.

This doesn't matter, it will become false when the timer runs out.


Yes and yes. Sounds counterintuitive, but if we manually turn either off the desire is to turn them both off and clear their timers.

For context, "The Hot Water" is actually controlling a plug that turns our recirculation pump on/off - so turning off the wife's hot water really doesn't have much effect :wink:


I understand. I have a circulating pump also. It's purpose is to keep hot water close to where it's used. I turn mine on with motion in any place where hot water is used: bathrooms, kitchen, laundry room. It is turned on for 5 minutes, and turns off 5 minutes after all of the motion stops.

Realistically, you don't need it on for the dishwasher after the first few minutes, because once the hot water is flowing, it's going to continue to be hot even with the pump off. So if I start my dishwasher (motion in the kitchen has turned on the pump before that), and then leave the house, the pump turns off after 5 minutes, and the dishwasher continues to run without the pump on. After 4 years of this, I can tell you the dishes get clean and the water stays hot.

As I said above, clearing the timers is irrelevant, you don't need to do that. If you want to turn off the dishwasher from manually turning off the hot water, then just add a simple trigger to do that. Trigger event: Hot water off, Action: turn off Dishwasher.


I've been experiencing this bug for the last few versions. I keep accidentally selecting the wrong scenes when I'm in a hurry. Could we get all menu items for all drop-downs to be sorted alphabetically?


OK, I know why. Will work on it.


Which bug? The AND OR XOR bug?


The lack of sorting for Scenes.