Newbie Question: Zigbee Status / Route Info

Hi everyone

Medical professional here so this is all new and challenging for me. Will appreciate the help

Recently switched from ST to Hubitat C7 and so far liking it a fair bit. Reason to switch was (1) ST going obsolete and (2) more flexibility with HE. When I migrated I TRIED to do things the "recommended" way for example (1) pairing devices in the location they'd sit (2) pairing repeaters first then lights and sensors (3) doing it slowly a few devices at a time (4) setting up automations once all the devices were in place.

However, I still find devices intermittently going "offline" especially bulbs. Most of the bulbs are either Ikea or Sengled Classic. I'm having trouble figuring out (1) when devices go offline - the Smartthings app had a friendlier interface and you could immediately see which device(s) were offline (2) understanding what route the devices are taking.

It was recommended on the forum to go to this link http://hubitat.local/hub/zigbee/getChildAndRouteInfo

My questions pertain to what am I looking at here?

  1. Is "Neighbor Table Entry" the devices that are DIRECTLY connected to the HE Hub?
  2. Is "Route Table Entry" the route the devices are taking?
  3. What is "status:Unused" meaning? A device that was once connected to the Hub is now offline or something else?
  4. I'm noticing that devices often don't appear on the output but they are NOT offline as they work (for example, many bulbs are not showing up in the list but they work). What's the explanation
  5. OTOH, there are some devices that don't appear in the "Route Table Entry" and ARE infact offline
  6. Suggestions as to what to do in order to understand why devices are going offline

Regarding the Zigbee network I have SEVERAL repeaters (started with 3 Tuya repeaters and 2 IKEA outlets, then when devices would randomly fall off the network, added one more IKEA outlet then added 2 IKEA repeaters). My flat is not huge but walls are all concrete.

Here's what a recent output looked like:

Note that most of the devices that don't appear WERE working so not sure why they weren't showing up

Then I rebooted the Hub and got this:

Now the next day this .......

And 12 hours later this ...... yet most devices nto showing up ARE working but 1-2 were truly offline

I will be VERY grateful for someone helping me understand what the read out means and whether I am interpreting this corretly.


First, welcome! ST refugee here too. You'll find a lot of us in this community.

If you haven't come across Rick's thread it's a good read.

The neighbors list is devices capable of repeating that are directly connected to the hub. They may or may not actually be repeating. The other devices are one hop away. If you have child devices they are non-repeating devices connected directly to the hub. If you have devices that are more than one away they won't show up. Also this is a pretty dynamic table - a snapshot of a point in time. It's good as a general indicator but it's not a complete routine table.

Basically you want LQI high and in/out costs low (but not zero). You have a fair number of repeating devices with high in/out costs. May be contributing to your issues.

For comparison here's what mine looks like.

I would also take a look at the potential for wifi interference. That can be a real issue, especially if your HE is sitting right next to an AP. There was one guy a few weeks ago who was having zigbee issues and it turned out his mesh network node made a great "stand" for his hub. Not so much :slight_smile:

Screen Shot 2023-01-27 at 8.00.05 AM

Are those Ikea bulbs also trying to repeat? Sengled bulbs do not. If the Ikea bulbs do, I would get them out of there. Zigbee bulbs that act as repeaters really wreak havoc. I did some searching online and I wasn't able to find anything definitive but I would suggest removing the ikea bulbs and see if that improves things overall. Many of us run separate hubs dedicated just to bulbs - in my case I have a Hue hub that manages all of my smart bulbs. You can also use a dedicated HE to do it.

I've generally shied away from Ikea repeaters. I find they don't seem to work as well as others. But other folks may have a different experience. I use smart plugs - the ST ones work really well and I've had good luck with INNR and Sengled. Dunno what the deal is with my drawing room lamp east though. Will have to check it out.


Hi Brad

Thank you so much for taking the time out to reply. Your post was very helpful. From what you wrote I understand things a bit better. I still have a few questions will be grateful if you could take a peek

  • devices (bulbs mainly) that are "missing" from that output are likely ≥ 2 hops away and are hence not showing up on the output. However, they may STILL be connected to the network there's just no way to tell other than observing whether they're working. Right?

  • I didn't realize IKEA bulbs (and repeating bulbs) are a problem. From the output some of the IKEA bulbs are repeating (in the first image I posted several devices are connecting to HE via TV2 which is an IKEA bulb. Question: probably 60-70% of my bulbs are IKEA, I'm pretty reluctant to get rid of them. Any other options? Are HUE bulbs better in this regard?

  • Is having a separate hub for lighting mandatory? I hadn't heard of this before

  • my HE is right next to my Google router ! I kept it there because it ws the most central location. My ST hub was originally placed at a distance for this interference reason and it kept dropping devices. I'm guessing you'd still advise moving the Hub?

  • I noticed your incost and outcost are quite low and you mention mine are high for several devices. Can you explain what LQI and in/out cost actually means. Most of them are bulbs and most showing higher numbers are IKEA. But several repeaters (Tuya for example) are showing much higher in/out costs (yours are mostly ones). Does this mean it's still an IKEA bulb issue or something more systemic? Could it be the wifi interference you alluded to?

Many thanks again

1 Like

There are ways to tell - if you do a search on XBEE you'll find tons of info. But from the route info you're looking at not really.

Not mandatory but definitely a best practice. You might want to confirm my theory on Ikea bulbs - I don't use them myself. Hue hubs are cheap (a lot cheaper than a couple Hue bulbs!) and the integration is excellent. There's a lot of information elsewhere in the forum on Ikea bulbs - many people report success using them on a Hue hub. Take a gander.

That I don't know since all of mine are paired with a Hue hub. What does work better is to set up a separate Hue hub for your Hue bulbs and use one of several Hue<>HE integrations. I did a quick search and I think you could connect your Ikea bulbs to a Hue hub too - so with a small investment in a Hue hub you could keep all those Ikea bulbs and be in good shape. But please confirm by looking at some of the Ikea threads. And if you do go the separate hub route for bulbs make sure it's on a separate zigbee channel.

I'm not an expert by any means but I will give you my layman's understanding. LQI, or Link Quality Index, is essentially the quality of signal received by the hub. Incost and Outcost are similar (different scale) but from the perspective of the other devices, not the hub. But a repeating device with high in and out costs is probably not a great repeater.

My guess is because those devices are talking directly to the hub and not through a repeater it's probably not the Ikea bulbs, it's more likely something else - I would definitely start with looking at wifi interference.

1 Like

If you want to really head down the zigbee rabbit hole take a look at this:

1 Like

Thanks again for such a useful message. So in summary, a potential approach is to get a Hue hub, link the IKEA bulbs to the Hue hub and then link the Hue hub to Hubitat. And keep the Hue Zigbee channel separate from the Hubitat channel?

Will look into it then thanks

1 Like

Absolutely. I think you'll find a ton of people here do just that. Wifi interference could still be an issue though so you'll need to take a look at that separately.

That document is way beyond my pay grade !!

LOL mine too.

OK I'll move the Hubitat to a different location and see how that works. My concern is that a lot of the devices may fall off the network but won't know until I try as you said.

And just one clarification - Hue hub WILL connect to non Philips bulbs?

That is a possibility but let it sit for 24 hours and see.

Hue hub will connect to SOME non-Phillips bulbs. I have successfully connected CREE bulbs (which I definitely do NOT recommend). I found this online...

1 Like

Thank you - will keep the group posted on how it goes

Yeah also take a look at other threads about Ikea bulbs and how people are using them, maybe pose a question or two to folks who actually use them. Since I don't, my information may not be as good as what you'll get there,.

@rlithgow1 @aaiyar do you guys have any additional insights?

The newer Hue bulbs are zigbee 3.0 and can be paired directly to Hubitat -- although most of my Hue bulbs are on my Hue bridge, I have a couple paired directly (long story!), and they work well. By "newer", I mean pretty much any Hue lighting you buy new now -- earlier-generation Hue bulbs (bulbs sold years ago) were ZLL not ZB3.0 and should not be paired directly.

INNR bulbs are zigbee 3.0 and can be paired either direct to HE or to a Hue bridge (official certified to work with Hue bridge), so they are the next most flexible option IMO.

I don't have experience with any other zigbee bulbs - unfortunately, zigbee lighting tends to be a wildcard in terms of compatibility, so I stick with definitely reliable solutions -- Hue first, then I'd go INNR. Some folks like Sengled too, but I don't think all of their models are trustworthy so research before purchase would be wise.

Good luck!


Sengled bulbs don't repeat. That's great from the perspective of not wanting to have bulbs -- especially bulbs in lamps that might have power cut rather than commanded by voice -- taking part of your mesh with them. But it means you need at least a few other ZigBee devices to act as repeaters for them.

I've got several Sengled bulbs, have been largely pleased with them, and am in the process of putting in more.

1 Like

Thank you for all the wise comments. Surprisingly I had always thought that bulbs that DO repeat were GOOD because it added additional potential connections available for devices that did not have a good link to the Hub. I'm guessing I was wrong. Most of my bulbs are IKEA (they used to be Sengled then I changed). I will look into INNR bulbs. I'm not in the US so choices are relatively limited

As an update to what @brad5 said, yesterday I came home to find my "Zigbee network is offline" - so frustrating. So I took it out from it's current location next to the Google router and put it at a distance. I've been monitoring the Router table and I "think" it's better (a lot more ones in the incost and outcost). Can't tell if the network is better. Would appreciate you guys' critical analysis

Once again many thanks for the input and help

1 Like

When the hub starts to experience severe load the zigbee radio is the first to go. So keep an eye on anything that could also be creating excessive load.

Thanks for the reply @brad5

So …

  1. How do I “keep an eye” for high load on the Hub. Are there any logs I can download that’ll shed light on what happened?

  2. Your thoughts on the new routine table - am I correct in inferring that with the new placement of the Hub things look improved? I’ll be quite honest I haven’t noticed any difference in performance in fact some lights seem to be coming on slower than before

Thanks again