I use sonos connects in my house... one for my whole-house speaker set and one for my family room where I have my "big boy" stereo and speakers. I love the quality and flexibility. With that said, I also have a Sonos Bar with a Sonos sub plus two Sonos One's paired for surround in my basement. This setup sounds perfectly good for most movies and casual music listening, parties, etc. However, when I am ready to crank up some Pink Floyd or Buckethead and lean back with my favorite beverage... the big boy stereo driven my Sonos Connect is the only way to go... actually, I usually will go with a BlueRay disk to truly get the full audiophile experience. In today's digital music world on demand most people are more than happy with the sound from wireless speakers. Heck, most people are happy to listen to satellite radio pumped into their cars despite its horrible dynamic range and overall quality. Compared to that Sonos wireless speakers are pretty amazing.
Sonos isn't just about wireless they sell wired systems as well if you use your phone as the source for your music and you just have their wireless systems then yeah it's wireless.
Just got my feet wet with my first Sonos. One question I have is did I just defeat my goal? By that, I see that it takes using their app to "ADD" speakers, but especially with things like this HE integration I don't really need the app beyond adding new devices.
By defeating my goal I mean my goal is to eventually eliminate all cloud "dependent" devices. Will this integration still function if for some mysterious reason that Sonos goes under and no longer able to access the app? I understand I wouldn't be able to "ADD" anymore, but will the existing speakers still function even without access to the sonos app?
I need reassured they would still work before I get $2k invested into speakers throughout the house and then Sonos pulls a Google/Nest, or maybe worse.
Even if they were to go under ( hard to imagine), there are so many out there, I would find it difficult to believe there would no one would write an alternative app. Plus the newer Sonos and Symfonisk support Airplay2, so you would have options there as well.
There’s also the new style Sonos Amp that can take a digital input and drive Sonos speakers.
I don't use Apple so Airplay doesn't come into play (pun intended)
. My main concern is for example this HE integration itself, does it rely on any communication with the Sonos app/cloud service, or is it done all locally similar to say telnet and Lutron or like Ecobee and reliant on their servers?
It currently uses dlna which is local, the official api which we will have to convert to at some point in the future is cloud based...
I wouldn't worry about sonos going under any time soon...
Well that's depressing.
If they were cheaply priced speakers I wouldn't worry about it, but their price point doesn't really equate to the "average" consumer buying their products. There's no telling how niche products end up, especially when competition pops up all the time. Most people thought AOL would be around forever.
But Thanks though Mike for giving me the foresight I do appreciate it
Why? This works so well. Is there a benefit that will outweigh the disadvantage that comes with a compulsory cloud connection?
We're in no rush to switch, until and if the time comes they decide to depricate that interface.
The Symfonisk are definitely priced to average consumer. With partnerships like this and other positive changes they’re making, their future looks pretty secure, either as an independent company or as a division of another.
You could see AOL sinking not long after the first Stand-alone email client software came to market. Sonos on the other hand has stood up well to competitors and very successfully reorganized.
I agree the Symfonisk are better priced, but it's still tied to the same ecosystem controlled by Sonos.
As far as stood up well, they've only had wireless "wifi" speakers going on 5 years now, there really hasn't been any competition besides now with google, amazon, and a few others and those are all cloud based. There hasn't been much competition in the local wifi market, but there will be eventually. Then lies the question which direction will Sonos take? And at the moment I will wait before making a big investment in them as if they were to do as Mike stated eventually "may happen" they could easily say we will now start charging a fee to use this service. And you are stuck either paying the fee or trashing $2k in speakers.
Another example is this Sonos one (gen 2) I just got, apparently the only difference over the (gen1) is a better processor and BLE (which is only used for pairing) and Sonos themselves states that no reason to get the Gen 2 over Gen 1 that it was only put out for "future features compatibility" but no one but them knows the direction they are heading.
Sonos is an extremely focused company who is playing their own game in the Wireless Music speaker space. Personally, I don't find any of their competitors to date compelling.
The One's (for me) were a step backward, as they introduced Microphones and "voice assistant" technologies.
Having said, that, recent product introductions seem to indicate they are looking to refocus back to their traditional "whole home" audio market that has been their stock in trade. The Port hearkens back to their early days of Zoneplayers,Amps and Connects, while the new One SL gets rid of the microphone and pulls the One back to what the Play:1 did, with some new tech like AirPlay 2 and Stereo pairing (which the original Play:1 didn't do).
Sonos has been doing WiFi/Ethernet speakers since 2004 ish, and are still here. Their ecosystem is solid, and frankly, like Ubiquity for networks hardware, they just work.
What they don't do well, is work well without the Cloud. I'm not sure how much we'll ever get through DLNA, but their controls really rely on the cloud. Sad, but there you go.
Audio quality is subjective, but as several on these forums have pointed out, Audio Quality when discussing WiFi speakers and streaming is all about source, and speakers, so the Connect/Amp/Port are probably where you'd look if you leaned towards the audiophile end of the market, while for me (for background music) the Play:1, 5, and Symfonisks are great.
YMMV of course!
S.
I would slightly disagree, they have integrated both popular voice assistants into half of their product line now with the new Sonos Move, but at least with the Move actually has bluetooth available that is actually usable outside of wifi, so at least that one item should still be in someway usable I would think without company control.
With Hubitat, I know it's designed on local control, which to me is actually top priority in these markets, as being burned by others by being dependent after purchase on sources beyond your control. I have no concern if Hubitat "integrates" with clouds because I can choose whether or not to use those devices, and if Hubitat goes under the product I purchase I still have complete control over as I do now. With Sonos, being cloud based control and integrating with other cloud devices, then it almost becomes a two way partnership on dependency, which I would think lean towards less likely to ever be a locally controllable device.
But no one knows that's the mystery, it's all risk/reward take a gamble at it. With Local I do know.
I agree with the points you make. If your interested in investing in sonos I can get whatever you want at my cost which is usually half the price of retail. If you want in wall or in ceiling speakers go with Sonance they make sonos higher end speakers which is sonance cheapest quality speaker. Sonance I get for around half as well.
I absolutely, positively agree with the desire for Local Control.
Having said that, while I Love my Sonos (bad sound quality and all @shawnx1!) I don't expect Sonos or any of it's competitors to ever embrace local control. It seems to me the business case from their perspective just isn't there. All these devices (Sonos and similar) are about embracing Music as a service. Without an internet connection, there is no service (e.g. streaming), so there is little incentive for them to develop local control. Adding Alexa/Google Home seems, to me, to be a key indicator that this is so, as it creates a second fundamental "need" for an internet connection beyond authentication/licensing/snooping/advertising.
Tablet/Phone based control seems to also be fundamentally "cloud", even if for only licensing/authentication, Although Hubitat shows it is possible and even desireable to have phone/tablet control through a local WebApp.
There are relatively inexpensive ways to roll your own locally controlled "Wifi" speakers with High Definition audio support and "pick your own" speaker capability (e.g. Sonance/Definitive/Polk/whatever), but you'd likely have to give up Voice Control (personally I don't use it, but it seems to be a driving factor for a lot of people). (Mycroft might be a workaround for this, but I'm not sure. -- this thread indicates it might be: Easiest way to use Mycroft completely offline - Support - Mycroft Community Forum ), but this approach isn't necessarily cheaper than Sonos, and with all the moving parts, it's certainy not easier, and would probably (in truth) be less reliable than Sonos + Hubitat.
At the end of the day, I hear you and I don't disagree with the goal/desire of local control for my Sonos, I just don't see a commercial motivation for anyone to provide something "like" Sonos with local control.
As always, YMMV.
S.
That's exactly what I said? Guess you had to get that in there. Whatever
Meant to be Tong-In-Cheek really.
Apologies if it didn't come across that way. For what it's worth, I have no doubt that the Sonance sound alot better, and I certainly envy your access to them at half price!
S.
No Need to Apologies I'm overly sensitive 
ST has announced a new intrigration with SONOS.
Is this the new api you were talking about? But its a local intrigration?
I have no idea what they're doing over there...
