Yes, I have a UZB stick, but this is unacceptable. The past 5 or 6 ghosts I've had, I have to break out the z-wave stick. With the current ghost, the log says it doesn't exist
" Failed node 6F remove status: 0 SDK failure node is no longer in failed node list" If the nodes not in the list why is it showing in Z-Wave details?
Yes, I've rebooted 3 times, and even pulled power from the hub, after proper shutdown. The device, a Wink motion sensor, has the battery out for 2 hours now.
After a shutdown, now when I try to "discover" the ghost to get the "remove" option, all I get is z-wave busy messages as well as "no reply"
2022-07-20 10:44:46.109 pm Failed node 6F remove status: no reply
sys:12022-07-20 10:44:36.113 pm Z-Wave Network responded with Busy message.
sys:12022-07-20 10:44:36.105 pm Failed node 6F remove status: no reply
I know it doesn't help to hear this, but HE can only be as good as the Z-Wave SDK releases from SilLabs, and there are (clearly) still issues in the SDK that SilLabs hasn't resolved.
Wasn't sure - are you saying you have the stick but don't want to use it to remove the ghost, or that you've tried to use the stick w/PC Controller and you could not remove the ghost?
When did you initially start setting up this C-7, or when did you last reset the Z-Wave radio (whichever is more recent)? One of the Z-Wave updates a while back introduced a new database format instead of SiLabs' proprietary format, which is reported to be less prone to corruption. The log entry you provided is one possible symptom of that (or it could literally mean what it says, but if the node is there and is marked as failed then...). Unfortuantely, we have been told that there is no way to go back and fix this retroactively, which leads me to believe that the only way to lessen the chances going forward is to be lucky enough to have started with a new database...hence my initial question.
Or use a secondary controller as a workaround for now.
Thanks for the replies gentlemen. I understand about the SDK flaws, but in that respect HE should be advocating on its customers behalf, as I'm certain people have ditched their hubs out of frustration, as I know I've been tempted to do several times. The consumer device is marketed by Hubitat and it's on them to have their product properly perform its intended functions, not pass the buck. I've never seen this lack of responsibility with any other products, and I have 40 years worth of goods.
I've never reset the radio, and if I have to reset & pair some 100 devices again, it's going to be on HA or ST. I originally setup the C7 z-wave around 6/2021.
As far as the stick, it's a real pain in the azz, huge time suck. The UZB-7 consistently fails to pickup newer devices paired to the hub's mesh, of which this motion sensor is the last item paired. I've hit update on PC Controller about 20 times. And if the failed node is not in the DB, then re-pairing the stick will have no effect, as it can't pickup a node that doesn't exist-unless the hub message is inaccurate or some other feature can compensate for the invisible node to be picked up.
And again just having to utilize this workaround speaks volumes.
If this is the case Hubitat should be supporting it's customers with a single free DB backup & restore for Z-wave, to help get the customer's database in a more reliable format, free of charge, assuming the restore would be into the new more stable format. Honestly I get the sense, that level of concern for customer satisfaction is low or altogether missing. Witness the number of customers who have been told "engineering is looking at this issue" for a myriad of problems and then never hear anything further, unless they complain in the forums.
I do appreciate you both trying to help, but instead of increasing satisfaction with using Hubitat, it's been mostly a huge time suck with ever decreasing returns and steadily increasing levels of frustration.
I'm just now remembering advice I gave someone else, to wait a few days and then try removal again. I know it makes no sense but it sometimes works.
Bad assumption. Basically, if the original proprietary database is corrupt, it cannot be fixed because every entry in the corrupt proprietary-format database makes it over to the new SQL format database.
Edit: Wouldn't it be nice if SiLabs released tools to edit their older proprietary db? I know that's been requested to no avail.
Once the database format is created, even moving back uses the old not the new database format so this would not work. It is much better to leave a lot alone. If you feel you must leave, we all wish you the best but as other devices follow the exact same SDK (HA, ST etc) you will also run into similar problems there. If you want the new database format you will need to nuke your existing z-wave db. This is essentually what you would need to do on HA (I don't know if ST has gotten the update) or ST because youd be starting over, Also necromancing old threads to complain about support is not really productive for anyone.
I could swear that when they did the database upgrade, there was a migration of the database to the new format. I remember they had to do it over the course of a few updates to make sure everything was stable because once you went past a certain point you could not go back to the old firmware.
Problem was if the old one was corrupted in some way, issues would be apparent after updating which were possibly previously hidden. After I resolved some of my issues everything has worked fine since. I am still stuck with two groups of "virtual" nodes that the hub creates. I was told the original ones must have had issues so the hub created new ones. It is slightly annoying when using PC Controller and zniffer but I would rather just leave it working how it is than start over.
If deciding between the two recommend you go with HA as ST's future seems uncertain and non-local. I've been playing around with the Zigbee2MQTT addon which works well but have not tested Z-Wave. You should be able to use that UZB-7 for a hopefully less frustrating experience and if you have not already, recommend you update the firmware on it. Latest radio firmware might resolve some issues with larger groups of devices but I haven't had the time to look into it. Also there are a few HE refugees you can connect with on the HA community site to commiserate. Am not sure about HA's support options though likely you will have to pay for a subscription in addition to supplying your own hardware..
For others who might follow this thread. We do NOT recommend or encourage the use of 3rd party devices that are NOT Z-Wave Plus v2 certified to remove nodes from an established Z-Wave network. Doing so may have negative consequences up to and including voiding hub's warranty or extended warranty offerd by Hub Protect.
Instead, we recommend using Compatible Devices that are known to work well with Z-Wave 700 series controller. Following the basic rules of building and maintaining a strong Z-Wave mesh would avoid the need to force remove "ghosts". In the cases where a device has died, force removal is available as long as the Z-Wave mesh is healthy.
If you suspect that you are dealing with a hardware issue related to Hubitat Elevation, don't hesitate to open a warranty case by visiting the following page:
For Hub Protect subscribers, please visit this page:
