I know this is probably not the correct forum for this but the Hubitat Community has become "the place to find the pro's" and I am having some trouble.
Some time ago, I built a high amperage smart control for my air compressor. I used a standard GE Z-Wave Plus on/off switch and coupled it to a 40 amp contactor to handle the load. Including all of the mounting boxes, I had about $43 into it. Not bad for a 40 amp smart switch. Every now and then, the switch will freeze in the on or off position (mostly happens in the on position). The only way to get it working again is to power cycle the breaker that the switch is on. It is the switch itself that is hanging and not the contactor. Figured I had a funky switch and have just been living with it.
Today I installed another one of the same GE switches on a bathroom fan. This time, it's just a standard direct wire (no external relay in the mix) since the switch is rated to handle the load of a bathroom fan. I am having the exact same problem with the switch freezing. It doesn't respond to local or digital control until I power cycle it (flipping the breaker off then back on).
I feel like I am missing something. Should I be throwing a starting capacitor on the line somewhere? Has anyone else had similar problems? Not really sure where to go from here.
I have found several threads where people discuss successfully using these switches non-lighting load applications but not any that discuss this problem.
Hmm ... I'm getting ready to put a zooz on a bathroom fan switch. It's well below the limit, but now I'm curious if we're going to have problems with it. I'll be following this thread.
Not my bathroom fan, but I have one that sticks on my bathroom vanity every so often. You can hear it click off, but three light doesn't go off. Anywhere from 1-10 on off manual cycles and it will go off.
I had to use a capacitor to stop this. I added from line to load (parallel to) at the fan. It was easy just to "backprobe" it into the molex connector at the fan. I robbed it out of a ceiling fan wireless module that I had laying around. I can't remember the voltage, or the farad ratings, sorry. I probably can untape it and pull it out of the fan tomorrow if you want me to...
No need to go through the trouble of checking. I have plenty sitting around. I had a feeling that adding a capacitor was going to be the solution. I'm glad to know it's not just me that's having the problem. I'll give it a shot and see if it solves my problem. If it does, I will post the specs of the cap I wind up using. Thanks!
We definitely recommend the relay part of the Double Switch for use with any fan, even one with low rating. Inductive loads like motors can draw up to 40 times the power they're rated for at start-up. It's for a split second and won't do anything to a mechanical switch but could damage the electronics in a smart switch, especially with repeated use, so it's best to use devices designed for this purpose.
The important thing to understand about smart switches is that they are not all created equally. Most smart 'switches' use an internal mechanical relay to tie LINE and LOAD together when the switch is turned on. This is really no different than your typical dumb switch, where LINE and LOAD are mechanically connected together to complete an electrical circuit.
However, some smart 'switches' do not utilize a mechanical relay, relying on transistor-like devices to allow the flow of current between line and load. These devices are not usually rated for inductive loads, like those found in a fan motor. These devices can be damaged if they are connected to the wrong type of load. This is the design found in most smart 'dimmer switches' as well, which is why they are never recommended for use with an inductive load.
Fan Controllers are designed specifically to handle an inductive motor load, and usually can even adjust speed of the ceiling fan.
So, in general... Use a Fan Controller for a typical ceiling fan. For a bathroom exhaust fan, use a smart switch that uses a relay to complete the circuit. Just be sure the switch's relay is designed to handle the load of a fan motor, especially the startup current spike.
I use Lutron Caseta Switches for bathroom exhaust fans with no issues whatsoever. I use Caseta Fan Controllers for ceiling fans.
The Double Switch is a smart switch but it's a 2-in-1 so we have a dimmer part for connected lighting (or you can use it as a remote control / scene controller if not used directly with any load) and a relay part which is designed to work with fans and for example switched receptacles. It was equipped with additional protection to withstand inductive loads and can be safely used to control fans.
Just as a follow up, to this thread. I recently had a normal GE Zwave switch terminally die (relay stay on) on a different bath fan than the one I put the capacitor on. I ended up replacing it with a different GE switch. There is a 43072 paddle or a 43074 toggle.
This Commercial Grade Enbrighten switch is motor rated, 120V/277V rated, and the newer style without side tabs and the switchable line/load terminals. It is meant specifically for fans, so probably less prone to the sticking issue.
Using Jason Joel's Enbrighten driver, it supports double/triple taps and all that.
We will see long term, but after a couple weeks, it is all good so far.
I am trying to determine what to use to smart control and automate a Panasonic bath exhaust fan FV-1115VQ1 that will be used in a small indoor spa room. So, I guess I cannot use the Caseta fan controller? I can only use a Lutron Caseta switch? fYI, I have Hubitat C7 with Lutron Smart Bridge Pro already integrated.
Here is the description: "WhisperCeiling® DC™ Precision Spot Ventilation Fan with built-in Pick-A-Flow™ speed selector switch allows you to select your required airflow (110-130-150 CFM). Features an ECM Motor with SmartFlow® technology and a Flex-Z Fast installation bracket."
I would like to control when and for how long to turn it on, then off, and specify the airflow, based on input from a separate humidity sensor located in the same room. Right now, I have a Zooz 4-in-1 sensor.
Okay, I think I got it: for my bath exhaust fan, I cannot choose it's CFM via smart controls. I can only select off/on via Lutron Caseta non-dimming switch.
Can I use the Caseta switch PD-6ANS in a button controller only setup? I do not want someone to cut power off at the switch, and kill the automation I am planning. Or, should I just get a differently branded button controller?
I would recommend using a Lutron Pico Remote instead, as Picos are much cheaper, and can be mounted in a standard decora style wall plate. Pico remotes work amazingly well with Hubitat via the Caseta SmartBridge Pro2. You can also choose from various Pico styles.
This particular bathroom exhaust fan is highly unlikely to be compatible with a Caseta Ceiling Fan controller.
From the specifications, it implies it is using a DC motor with some built-in smarts.
ECM motor with SmartFlow™ technology
WhisperCeiling® DC™ is designed to perform as rated. When the fan senses static pressure, its speed is automatically increased to ensure optimal CFM output. This feature provides peace of mind, as the installer doesn’t have to worry about compromising the fan’s performance, even with a complicated duct run.
Ah, I totally missed the built-in smarts. Thanks for pointing this out.
I cannot use a Pico remote unless there is already a Caseta wireless non-dimmer switch wired to the bath fan, right? If so, should it be hidden behind the drywall to prevent manual shutoff and leave the Pico embedded in the wall plate? Or, is there a way to wire the switch to allow always-on power for smart control?
