To be clear, I did not say the entire TOS was unenforceable, only this specific provision... And that was just my opinion which I clearly stated.
I am dropping out of this discussion at your request.
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The app/driver "store" discussion comes up now and again.... it always dies... some users are willing to pay so I don't think that's the problem anymore... dunno...
Maddie over at rboy says that Hubitat policy doesn’t allow them to create apps. I guess we are stuck between a Hubitat and developers pointing fingers at each other.
This is quite sad. I am curious though why would you discourage folks from selling apps, it’s not like Hubitat itself is free. I’m sure many users would gladly jump ship if his apps and awesome support are available on Hubitat.
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Maybe I am wrong but that sounds like that people can't just go and make their own paid apps UNLESS they have some type of agreement (monetary, legal, or otherwise) with Hubitat.
I guess what I don't get is what does Rboy offer that isn't available through other methods? I looked through his listing of apps, and there isn't really anything that I haven't seen on here for free, via Rule Machine, or other native apps... 
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That’s is what it seems like. Hubitat builds their product off SmartThings and sells it but others can’t sell apps for Hubitat 
I used to use free apps on SmartThings but I found that devs moved on after a while which left me the lurch more than once.
I just love the quality of rboy apps and support the rboy team provides. I feel like I’ve gotten a lot more out of the lifetime subscription than what I’ve paid for (and my spouse is 
)
At the end of the day you get what you pay for and everyone has to earn their paycheck. I do hope that Hubitat and rboy can figure something out.
That seems 100% up to the rboy folks... if they haven't approached Hubitat formally on the topic, which I've seen Hubitat say multiple times, that seems like it would be step 1.
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OP here. When I created this post on February 2018, I had been in contact with Rboy and this what he had said:
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Seem to contradict each other. But then again, the "CEO" (would have been better if they stated who they reached out to) at that time isn't the same "CEO" that is at Hubitat now. Maybe they need to reach out again?
Or better yet, reach out to a human - not a title - and engage with Bruce directly. Ball still seems clearly in RBoy's court.
But whatever. Any RBoy app subscribing HE user with development skills theoretically would have ported the RBoy apps they wanted to use over to HE for personal use a long time ago anyway. I realize that doesn't help the masses, though, and more options on HE is a good thing.
I've looked at RBoy's code in great detail in the past. While there are definitely some clever things in there, and it is a nice/polished offering, there isn't anything they do in there that can't be done outside of their paid apps. Out if the apps I looked at (I didn't look at them all) I don't see the huge need/desire to have then on HE. But, again, more choice is good in general I guess.
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Agree I am just trying to provide details I know as the OP, almost 2 years later 
. In February 2018 locks didn’t work well on HE and no lock code management app existed. HE has come a long way since then and I really don’t have a need for the Rboy apps any longer for my simple cases.
FWIW This unfortunately violates Rboy’s license.
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Yup, it sure does. But as with all licensing agreements the license holder would have to demonstrate that there are actual damages before they could pursue legal action.
Good luck with that if an individual that paid for the apps is using them for personal use and not sharing or distributing the code to anyone else.
For the record, I am currently running no RBoy apps on my hubs - so I'm not worried about it personally.
But for those that want/need the RBoy apps on HE, let's hope RBoy reaches out to Bruce and that they can work out an arrangement.
If not, then there isn't much to discuss/argue about really.
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I've have been speaking with rboy he says he is more than willing to bring his code over to hubitat. Could someone please reach out to him?
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He's free to bring them over, and could have done so at any point since we launched Hubitat. But, he's not free to charge for them per the TOS. Since he's "more than willing", then surely it's time for him to offer his apps for free like everyone else does, e.g. Package Manager, Hub Connect, about 100 drivers, etc., etc.
LoL just wow. Ive never known anyone who had a business willing to offer their product for free. I had not realized that hubitat would not be willing to come to an understanding with him. I would have saved some time.
I won't bring it up again.
I think the implication is that RBoy and Hubitat would have some type of agreement, whether monetary or otherwise. Correct me if I am wrong, but I am reading that statement above as Hubitat doesn't want people charging money, without the blessing of Hubitat. And maybe a cut of the profit???
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Hey my thoughts exactly. This was the line of thought I was going getting after as well. I think it'd be more than appropriate for hubitat to get a piece of the action.
However negotiations have to happen to get there. Which is why I've been trying hard to get everyone to talk to eachother.
I'm apparently missing some obvious hurdle. Given @bravenel response to me i give up.
Isn’t that RBoy’s deleted post immediately above yours? Perhaps he deleted it and then directly reached out to the concerned party at Hubitat?
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It's been a year but I think the underlying issue is unchanged.
If they work something out behind the scenes, maybe we'll see RBoy apps on Hubitat.
I doubt they want to have much of a public discussion about it here though. If I were staff, I wouldn't. 
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Beat me to it.
Yep, that isn't pubic forum information.
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I just moved over from SmartThings I am a bit confused I used a number of RoyBoy apps on SmartThings and liked them found them useful.
Why would Hubitat try and stop a developer from making money on their work?? What does it take for Hubitat to invite a developer to work on their environment??? Why is it ok for Sharptools to charge $30 a year but RoyBoy can’t charge $39 bucks for a lifetime license for 32 drivers and 22 apps? I am not a programmer and am willing to pay for a persons time if it gets the job done better than anything else does. If this is supposed to be a community supported device then how is it wrong to support the community??? This is something that should be openly discussed by the community because it will be the community that will makes this product thrive !!
Without being any of the parties involved, I would speculate that Sharptools and Hubitat came to some kind of agreement, likely monetary compensation of some type. Who knows what they agreed to.
Whereas Rboy for whatever reason can not or did not come to an agreement with Hubitat for reasons unknown. And that is not up to the community to negotiate those terms. I don't think it is some evil Hubitat plan to exclude Rboy. It is simply the way that Hubitat has set up their terms of service.
And many people on here do donate via Paypal or otherwise to developers. You are certainly free to do that. They did spend lots of time and effort for these community based apps. Nobody is stopping that.
I did not come from Smartthings so maybe I am missing something, but by a cursory glance, nearly or everything he offers is on Hubitat in one form or another. I don't really see the need for his apps, but again maybe I am missing something.
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