Some Rule Machine Rules Not Triggering

[user837]

General Information:
Platform - 2.4.3.164
Hub Model - C8

Issue / Symptoms:
Some Existing & All New Rule Manager Rules Will Not Trigger:

BACKGROUND:
I have just finished up a project that; for the most part, had a primary purpose to replaced all of 700 series devices with 800LR series devices and upgrade Amazon Echo 15" to 21". This resulted upgrade to

• 15 HomeSeer LS100 Leak Sensors

• 09 ZEN14 Double Plugs

• 02 ZSE50 Alarms

• 05 ZEN20 Power Strips

• I am listing this to show the amount of change this introduced this introduced including the the three EZ desktops that are maintained. As a result, this has led to several issues. The primary of which is with rule triggering.

I am including the screenshots below of the ZWave results after the upgrade as I suspect this may be part of the questions for those willing to help with the issue after that work. I also want to paste this link into another thread discussing the value of upgrading to ZWave 800 series devices. For me it was very positive. The routing resulted in an approximate 90% of my devices connecting directly to the hub. See ZWave table screenshots below:

Going into the upgrade I was worried about excluding so many device that have been connected for over 4 years. Although I did have trouble with three, two of them came out with the ZWave refresh remove, refresh remove, refresh, remove.....you get the idea :-). The remaining device I had to purchase an Aeotec 700 Plus Z-Stick and use my existing copy Simplicity Studio to remove it. The device as a version 1 Zooz 20 power strip (had a lot of problems with these). So very grateful to Danabw, jtp10181, alexcapone, and to 672southmain for this PDF on how to use Simplicity Studio to remove a ghost device. Without the help from these individuals (and the others) I had the opportunity to read their input on this topic I would hot have been successful getting this done. That you guys so very much. I do try to contribute when I can but many of you are so fast and so much more smarter than I am. Now with the background of of the way on to the triggering issues.

Example Trigger Issue 01 [Living Rule TV Volume Based On Nest]:
It started with this rule not triggering. This was an existing rule that has been in place for several years. The devices involved in this rule were not involved in the change. What is interesting here is that; although the rule will not trigger, if I press the run action one the thermostat is in the heating mode (to satisfy the while/repeat condition) it will continue to run / loop until the thermostat is no longer heating and then ends just like is should. It just does not initially trigger like the other trigger issues I am seeing.

2025.12.05 - Example Trigger Issue 02 [Home Security Monitoring MB TV On When Perimeter Motion Detected:
Found another rule not triggering. I spent a fair amount of time breaking this apart and no section would run. I then created a new rule. One section at-a-time to eliminate the possibility this rule (and others) may have become corrupted some how. Created each section and stopped after the 1st section with an action item. The rule would not work. At that point I abandoned the approach and created the next rule below. This is when I found that even a simple rule is not triggering (See Trigger Issue 03).

Example Trigger Issue 03 [Simple One Action Rule With Write To Log Action]
This rule was created after the updates. The device used WAS one of the updated devices. The objective / action of the rule is to write to a message to the log upon successful trigger (when the computer room light state is changes).

This is the log when the light was manually run via the Run Action button within the rule and did not rely on the rule to be triggered. Notice it ran successfully.

This log entry was from the light being turned off by EZ Dashboard. Notice there is no successful write to log. Notice there is no successful write to log. This log entry is not from the rule being triggered. The entry is being generated instead from the logging entries selected from within the rule itself (Events, Triggers, and Actions) are selected.

This log entry was from the light being turned on using the on button within the device itself. Notice there is no successful write to log. This log entry is not from the rule being triggered. The entry is being generated instead from the logging entries selected from within the rule itself (Events, Triggers, and Actions) are selected.

This concludes 4 days now that I have been trying to figure this out. I have:

• Tried to isolate old vs. new rules
• Tried to isolate old vs devices
• Isolate mesh-network
• Do a backup and restore and eliminate old logs & unused device names
• Go through each device and where possible activate it so make sure it is working.
• Added a device and re-added it. No change. Rule will still not trigger.

I hope it is something dumb I am missing; however when I see such a simple rule not triggering I am not so sure.

I would very much appreciate the community's help and don't know how to "tag" in support on this issue. I am positive it is related to all the changes I have put the little hub through.

Because of the duration of the changes I don't have a backup I can roll back to and it would be impossible to do so since over 30 + devices have already been excluded and some are no longer here (file 13).

Thanks so much for any help you can provide.

• Don

[hubitrep]

• are you able to show a screenshot of the triggering device's event by going to the device's details page, events tab, click on the event you believe should have triggered the rule?
• for the rule not triggering as you expect and click it circled "i" icon, then show a screenshot of the event subscriptions?

[user837]

Thank you for getting back to me. Below (hopefully) are the screenshots you requested.

Device:

Rule:

[hubitrep]

• the arrow is not pointing at an actual device event but rather the command issued from the hub. You have some device events further up in in the list, the ones labeled "switch" (the name of the device attribute the event pertains to)
• if the device attribute (switch) is already in the target state, Rule Machine will not receive an event, it will be filtered.
• you have selected a "physical" event for your rule trigger. anything done by the hub (i.e. any command) will generate a "digital" event and not trigger your rule. You can see which type of event it is in the list, "Type" column. Given these are Lutron devices, activating via the switch paddle or via the Lutron app is the only way to trigger a "physical" event.

Somewhat confusing in your screenshot is that there are some "physical" switch events that trigger your test rule (see Triggered Apps column) and others that don't (only see Amazon Echo Skill in the list of triggered apps).

@user837

This log entry was from the light being turned on using the on button within the device itself. Notice there is no successful write to log.

Had not noticed it before but your screenshot clearly shows the device reporting this as a "digital" event, and since your trigger is set for "physical", the result is as expected : the rule does not trigger.

[user837]

OhMyGoodness

I just checked it on the simple test rule. IT WORKS

Now that I have almost calmed down from excitement. Just so that i am sure I am getting something so obvious to me now lol that completely blew over my head my for 4 days. Clicking on the run now within the device was considered "physical" while running it from rule manager or from EZ Desktop was considered "digital". I am not sure why switching from a 700 series device to an 800 series now makes this differentiation so that is completely irrelevent isn't it..........THANK YOU AGAIN.

I really would like to buy you a cup of coffee. Would you kindly accept? How can I do so? I always like to contribute to developers who's products I use and to those; in cases like this, who help I am so thankful for. I am not the smartest guy in solving problems but do when I can. This would be one way to allow me to say thank you.

• Don.

[user837]

I am working my way through the rules now and will report back once all the remaining rules are finished. There are some rules that are triggered differently; for example, by conditions vs. devices that also stopped so may need your help as well if you don't mind.

[user837]

Here is a similar situation; however unlike the others, I am unable to change the the differentiation between physical and digital (or at least I can't see where).

Rule:

Log:

Subscriptions:

Device Event Log:

You will see in both the Hubitat & device logs that the opening of the door was detected but the rule was not triggered. Unfortunately, just like in the case of the lights, I am probably overlooking a setting comparable to digital vs. physical. I have looked but I don't see something that equates to these types of devices. My apologies in advance.

I did find one more that use to work that deals with the furnace transitioning to a heating state as the trigger but will not wear out my welcome (hopefully I have not already done so). After all these physical device swap-outs and other changes I will just abandon this rule.

Thanks again in advance for your help.

Sincerly,
Don

[hubitrep]

@user837

Subscriptions

If there are no event subscriptions for the rule, then it will never trigger. Try hitting "Update" or "Done".

[user837]

No change after pressing the update and done

Thinking the system recognized that there were no changes and didn’t do anything I erased some comments that were there impressed update, and done again. Still no change. Subscription remains blank.

I also cleared cookies in cache just in case. Also no effect.

[hubitrep]

@user837

No change after pressing the update and done

In that case you may want to try deleting the triggers and re-creating them. Without event subscriptions, the rule cannot ever fire.

Seems strange that devices labeled "motion sensors" are being checked for "wet" in the second trigger...

[user837]

I will try recreating first one in the morning and follow up with you.

I am using an Aeotec ZWA019 ZWave leak sensor to communicate the detection of motion that was received from the output of wired leads on a mechanical. Although misleading works really well.

Hope you enjoy the rest of your evening.

[user837]

I tried removing and re-adding the triggers but that did not add the Event Subscriptions back.

I then renamed the rule and created a new one with a slightly new title " Security - Triggered Event Armed Home Monitoring [TV Activated 23:00 - 06:59] #RULEMACHINE0050MOTIONSECURITY" just in case the system would somehow link it back to the original entries (possible corruption) some how.

New Rule:

New Event Subscriptions:

New Log:

IT WORKS!! I have about 9 or so rules to re-create but not a big deal. In the case I disabled the errant one and was able to copy and paste 90 percent of the old rule into the new rule. I did try to clone it but no luck there.

I am for the delayed response. On Sundays I make my way arounds to various family & friends and just got back in and was able to do this.

Lastly, I am so appreciative for your help. I tried everything I could before reaching out and would have never solved this. I also have learned quite a few things as I typically do from you and the community.

Thank you again and may I please treat you to a cup of coffee or the beverage of you choice via PayPal of some other method. I would like to show my appreciation for you time and willingness to help.

One other question, when I click on the "I" on a rule I see this dialogue box in the upper right corner. What is the purpose of this button?

• Don

[hubitrep]

@user837

What is the purpose of this button?

That red button is used to permanently delete the app instance (in this case: your rule). I think that's why they made it red, so that it looks scary.

@user837

would like to show my appreciation for you time and willingness to help.

Happy things are working for you. Best way to show your appreciation is to give back to this community with what you've learned. Lots of people have helped me over the years. We're even Steven