Slow response times isn't always what you think

Many times i see someone posting something about slow response times. there are a lot of reasons for slow response most of the reasons given are usually related to WIFI. Although this is an issue in a lot of cases there is one reason for slowness that i never see anyone post or suggest.

I have about 100 smart devices and over time i have resolved all the slowness that i was experiencing by reducing the amount of access these devices have.
I have switched out almost all devices that require an app or internet to run.
the remaining devices i block access to the internet.

Things like hue, generic matter devices, lutron all reach out to the internet. shutting off their internet access greatly increases performance.
Things like Ecobee require internet access so they can collect data from your device and they provide some weather data. They also require you to have internet access to be able to adjust the schedules. I set the temps at 70 then blocked them from the internet. I also use a smart switch to turn on and off my boiler based on time of day and temperature of outside/inside using hubitat. This changed my oil usages from 4 fills a year to 1 fill a year. so at the moment the ecobees never get access and they are not even used.
All of my IOT devices and apple tv's are on a separate network that is blocked to the internet. I only allow the apple tvs out on a couple of ports so i can stream TV. The HomePods are allowed out on a couple of ports so siri can work.

All the user workstation and phones are separated by firewall and have limited access into the IOT network.

I also use Unifi Network and Protect. these require internet access for remote management. If you block these from the internet your performance will triple. The cameras will populate instantly. Moving around in the app responsiveness is instant.

The reason i think the performance increases soooo much when you block the internet is because all these IOT devices are all talking to amazon. these amazon servers are not always responding quickly. some days you will see good response some days you will see poor response. Turn off the internet and it's always superb response.

There are only 2 ports that Unifi devices need for remote access. i only enable them when i will be remote.

to be able to turn off your internet you also need to provide some services internally.

  • You must host your own DNS server
  • You must host your own NTP server
  • You must NAT all NTP requests to your internal NTP server.
  • You must configure your DHCP to server your DNS settings.
  • You must use NAT to override any hard coded DNS settings in these devices.

I plan to do some kind of presence detection to update my firewall when i leave the house. but for now thats a manual process. 2 seconds to change.

so don't always blame your network. amazon is working hard to collect all your data and slow you down. Break your ties to amazon and your life will speed up. :wink:

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While I don't disagree, the average person will not go through the lengths you have to block access to the Internet and Amazon.

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I did not block anything (yet) and I don't see any performance degradation.

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i agree.

I block the internet for multiple reasons. One is for performance. Another one is i don't want my devices to become a launch point to attack something else. Granted odds are probably low but I'll take the precautions. Also not everything is zigbee.

That sounds like a lot of effort and, respectfully, I think you’re over-selling the “performance” gains in the absence of any objective data to demonstrate what you’re claiming.

Why is this relevant to Hubitat if the integration with Lutron uses a local, Telnet connection?

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Lurton with many of the IOT devices reach out to the internet. The biggest offender in my environment is the Unifi stuff. When the internet is available it tries to connect to amazon servers. These are sometimes sluggish to respond. Causing your app to hang for a couple of seconds. When it cannot reach the internet it defaults immediately to local authentication and the app responds instantly. Granted a couple of seconds is minor to most and even undetectable to most.

My test involved opening the app. timing it. closing the firewall. timing it. not too scientific but it did give reproducible noticeable results

I believe this is the case with most of the new wifi Matter devices, that a lot of folks here rave about.

They use the "matter is locally controlled" phrase to make you feel safe, but those devices phone home to push metrics to AWS.

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@dandanache Agreed.
However there are some devices for which Zigbee is not possible (or not without spending ALOT). Examples:

  1. Security system, It communicates via the cloud and cell backup. The device status can be brought into Hubitat (from the cloud) to run automations off of the security devices (instead of having two devices on doors, which means 2x the cost and 2x the battery changes)
  2. Mitsubishi t-stats controlling ducted mini split air handlers. Currently have a Honeywell Redlink Gateway that picks up the Mitsu redlink signals from all the t-stats, sends the data to the Honeywell Total Connect Comfort cloud, and Hubitat pulls if from there. Would love a way to control these locally without spending $1000's but not sure that exists.
  3. Airthings - although I have read that for a $150 local gateway I might be able to make these entirely local.

Things I have localized by blocking their access to the internet:
5. Samsung TV
6. Two variations of wifi Ceiling Fans, after I pair them with Bond and bring the Bond fan into Hubitat, but they needed internet to set up.

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I’m still not understanding how any of this is relevant to Hubitat’s integration with Lutron, which is always a local Telnet connection, regardless of how Lutron’s native mobile app connects to a Caseta smart hub.

Come to think of it, why is this relevant for Hubitat’s hue integration? That is another integration that works completely locally at all times.

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You can build a 100% zigbee security system on the cheap, w/ or w/o batteries. But I think the main part of having a security system is to have a company for "interventions" when the alarm triggers and you are in another city. Otherwise your "security" system just helps you find sooner (maybe in real time) that your stuff has been / is being stolen.

Maybe Daikin + Faikin, don't know if Daikin makes ducted units.

For PM2.5, VOC, Temp & Humidity you can use IKEA Vindstyrka - no batteries yay!, they also have the Starkvind - not for HEPA zealots :smile:

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I don't go thru those extremes but Pi-Hole spends most of its time blocking my wife's two Peloton devices (192.168.1.136 & 192.168.1.141).

i guess im trying point out 2 things. iot device make external connections. the ones that use the AWS to do authentication get slowed down. so for some of the devices its just sending out metrics. for others its a two way conversation that slows things down.

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Ok, well at least the good news for us as Hubitat users is that LAN-only integrations exist for Lutron and Hue.

Did I mention that already? :slightly_smiling_face:

I’m not sure why this matters for Hubitat users of Matter devices either (see what I did there?). Once commissioned, those devices are integrated with the hub via the LAN too.

But I’ve never used a Matter device, so maybe there’s something there I’m totally missing.

But probably only to certain subdomains that made it onto a blocklist because they’re associated with serving ads, or collecting data, etc., right?

My pi-hole’s doing the same thing.

Based off of this thread, and several others, OP appears to take a pretty hardcore, underground bunker type approach to cloud access to/from his home.

The juice doesn’t seem worth the squeeze to me.

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I concur. Blocking Peloton completely from its home servers is not an option because my wife does their online classes

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Blockquote[quote="dandanache, post:12, topic:144727"]

You can build a 100% zigbee security system on the cheap, w/ or w/o batteries. But I think the main part of having a security system is to have a company for "interventions" when the alarm triggers and you are in another city. Otherwise your "security" system just helps you find sooner (maybe in real time) that your stuff has been / is being stolen.

Yes, I'm referring to a monitored system with internet and cell backup

Maybe Daikin + Faikin, don't know if Daikin makes ducted units.
The issue here is I'm not going to spend $10k's in replacing a perfectly working HVAC just because my Hubitat integration goes through the internet...

For PM2.5, VOC, Temp & Humidity you can use IKEA Vindstyrka - no batteries yay!, they also have the Starkvind - not for HEPA zealots :smile:
[/quote]
Primarily seeking Radon; I should have been more specific

Sounds like you used wireshark or something to determine what was going where and how and wither or not it was critical for basic functioning. Such that If you drop its traffic will it do nothing else but hammer away.