Segue from router ban to healthcare discussion

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Well, we're bit off the router topic, but so be it. Sadly, this comment is true. It's not a left vs right, liberal vs conservative, etc., thing anymore. It has become a battle between those who realize what is being done to 99% of us vs those who don't yet realize it and continue to accept the scraps.

We are now wealthy enough as a nation to feed everyone, educate everyone, give healthcare to everyone. We just choose not to. Doesn't mean we need to squelch entrepreneurs or those willing to work harder for luxury. That can be not just allowed, but encouraged. It doesn't mean we need to simply pay people to do nothing (which has always been a convenient myth without much basis in fact). But also doesn't mean we need to accept things as they are, which has become wildly out of balance. Time to stop voting against our own best interests. Vote for a chance at (foundation for) better. The current leadership is not doing 99% of us any real favors, and if we stop and think about it for a minute, I think most of us, deep down, realize it.

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Sorry, but with all due respect I don't think the veil has been lifted. There is no wealthy enough "We". Just 19 American households hold $2.6 trillion in wealth, controlling more wealth than the bottom 50% of American households. As for the government, U.S. Treasury reports dating back to 1997 have indicated that projected liabilities over 75 years outweigh U.S. assets. None of this changes with a vote. I'm not suggesting that anyone give up or deciced not to vote. In fact I call on the deadbeats that don't vote to get off their lazy arses and at least cast a ballot.

As for universal healthcare, as an example it took real vision and some serious deal making to bring universal health care to Canada by way of the Medical Care Act of 1965 , which didn't take effect until 1968 . By 1971, all provinces and territories had implemented universal medical insurance plans, which was later strengthened by the Canada Health Act of 1984. This was hard fought and still is, for a population that was around 21.5 million in 1971 and is today only around 41.5 million. American childern (myself included) were and still are brainwashed that socialism is a bad thing, or even more ingnorantely that socialism and communism were the same thing. Yet another big lie taught at young ages and passed down like inherent racism. The best humanitarian programs in the short history of the US have been socialist in nature. It's the big lie, persistent corruption and pervasive ignorance that has kept them from growing to meet the needs of the US population.

The US today unfortunately isn't in a place for this kind of change while a senile socipathic dictator is controlling everyone. The suffereing is only going to intensify the longer the damage continues. When true leadership can eventually clean up the mess and corruption, it will very like be replaced with another corrupt leader that will swing the pendulum the other direction in 4-8 years. This happens in many goverenments on different time frames. We were made to believe from childhood that things were generally under control, but it's all been a lie.

Because of the unchecked and uncontrollable corruption, together with misguided trust in the US economy, the world economy is now set to crash just as planned, and the US stock market will demand the same bailout they have always expected since Alan Greenburg first started that trend in 2008. The top power mongers know this will lead to even greater wealth for them as it always has, and they are all contributors in one form or another to making it happen.

So yeah, routers are the least of our problems.

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I lived in Canada and have family in Canada. Their health system is in many ways substantially worse than what we have in the US if you consider the care and not the cost. I have a family member that has been waiting 28+ months for a surgery in Canada that would have been executed by multiple providers and cash pay options in the US within 90 days using an outpatient facility of your choice. The promise is there, but Canadian Healthcare is not in my opinion an example of working social medicine. It's there, but it's not good.

Ok,has there been any progress on the router situation?

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I wasn't comparing quality of care, and many are less likely to have care at all in the U.S. is more the point that @Madcodger was making and I was referencing. I have lived here for 27 years and have been taken care of very well. Better to at least have a system that cares, not a business model based on acceptance criteria alone in my experience.

Not every town or hospital in the US or Canada has great health care. My parents live in Oregon and it's a struggle to maintain the proper care and there are many problems. When my brother was dying in California, he was badly mistreated and cared for in a particular hospital. If you want perfection, that's a dream that will never be fulfilled.

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You forget to say router.

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That update was already posted, and I have the same information. Thoughts on router manuf. ban for the usa - #96 by tray_e

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I'd prefer they stay home. I believe the right to vote carries with it a requirement to educate yourself. If you're sufficiently educated on the issues and the people that are running, that ought to be all the incentive one needs to go vote.

Let the deadbeats stay on the couch and watch Friends reruns. They can't do any real damage that way.

If it were up to me, you'd have to pass a test before being able to vote. Just asking what the three branches of government are would disqualify 50% right off the bat.

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When I first voted as an 18 year old, I didn't study the issues like I should have and made choices based on emotion, I admit that. You do, you make mistakes and you correct. If we had a culture of higher voter turnout, it stands to reason that we would have a more educated voter population. Respectfully, damage comes from not participating in our democracy, and that is more apparent now than ever.

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Greater than 50% of the USA federal budget is already spent on social welfare programs. As the Boomers retire and birth rates shrink those programs will only grow as a percent of total spending. The trillions of growing national debt will be left to be paid by future generations.

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It's around 66%, and it needs to be wisely optimized so it can be expanded. Costs in the healthcare and pharmaceutical industry are out of control. Future generations need something to want to pay for, rather than a threat of annihilation for themselves or anyone else.

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That question would certainly disqualify the senior senator from Alabama from voting ...

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No words... I have none.... I don't even know if I should laugh or cry.... maybe both

His dad quit school at 16..... and taught him everything he know'd. (And I can make fun of hicks.... I am one)

P.S. I think you should have to be able to demonstrate that you know the three branches, AND WHAT THEY ARE ALLOWED TO DO before electing someone to fill that spot.

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Yes, it should have disqualified him from being elected in the first place.

I'm not familiar with the senator or who ran against him, maybe his opponent was even worse. Who knows. That's not an excuse for the staggering display of ignorance on this subject though.

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Ignorance seems to be a requirement these days. :face_with_symbols_over_mouth:

A certain set of voters doesn't seem to like politicians who are smarter than them.

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He likely got a few too many hits in the head as a free safety for the SAU Muleriders.

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Here's a quick rundown on recent Alabama senatorial politics. For a 2017 special election for Senator, the Republican candidate (Roy Moore) was hit with multiple credible accounts of pedophilia.

Unsurprisingly, he lost that special election to Doug Jones, who was the U.S. Attorney for the Northern District of Alabama. Among Sen. Jones' legal accomplishment was the successful prosecution of KKK members (in 2001) for the 1963 Birmingham church bombing. Alabamians decided to replace Senator Jones with former Auburn football coach, Tommy Tuberville.

Given his legal background, and the fact that he was a U.S. Attorney, it seems likely that Doug Jones knows the three branches of government, and also who we fought in WW2.

His replacement, Senator Tuberville, led Auburn to a #2 national ranking in 2004 and an SEC title that year. But no national title.

I don't live in AL, but I know.

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And Tuberville is now planning to run for governor of Alabama. Against Doug Jones. Should be a good matchup. Hopefully Jones wins this time.

The lack of knowledge on the part of MAGA is truly stunning. I have several "friends" (people I see at a local watering hole and must sometimes deal with in the community) who fall into that camp. Truly some of the least-informed/misinformed people I know. It's not that their opinions alone are different than mine. They have constructed an alternate reality that goes against science, proven events, and all too often, common sense. Trying to have a rational discussion based on known, never-disputed (before) facts is like talking to someone from an alternate universe. When one of them went off on a rant about how 5G cellular towers were being used for mind control I had to excuse myself and take a fake call. The irony did not escape me. Now I just avoid that guy, because there's just no rational thought there.

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There was a prophetic comedy out several years ago. Look up "Idiocracy". It's funny because it's true (and not funny for the same reason).

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That kinda stuff is terrifying. To see how easy it is to lead 30+% of the population totally off the cliff.

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Healthcare in Canada is not perfect, but I challenge anyone to show me a country where it is. Everyone has an opinion on the way it should operate, however there are just too many complex variables to enable everyone to feel happy and perfectly cared for. I work in healthcare and have for many years now. Yes, there are bad care providers and facilities. This isn't unlike any other career or occupation outside of healthcare. I don't feel this is by any stretch the "norm". Despite being human, the expectation is that we will make no errors. This simply isn't realistic. People are tired, burnt out, and in many cases have compassion fatigue.

I do have an opinion based on my experience and interactions with the healthcare system (as a patient), other healthcare providers and other patients. When individuals in Canada need urgent care or procedures, I venture to say they will receive that care quickly. We have long waiting lists for some types of surgery and non-critical care. As I mentioned before it isn't perfect. What I do enjoy is being able to call my physician's office and make an appointment. I don't worrying about whether it's covered by insurance, I don't worry about getting prior approvals for care, or if I can afford any co-pays. Prescription prices are generally very reasonable compared with other parts of the world.

I sleep much better at night knowing that I, along with all other residents, have access when needed. If we look at why healthcare is so bogged down, we really need to take a closer look at ourselves. Not everything can be mitigated on our own. Consider the number of visits to a physician or hospital for things such as smoking related illnesses, alcohol misuse, drug misuse, high risk activities, and many more to name just a few. Don't get me wrong, I like to have that greasy burger just as much as many others. I'm just not prepared to blame the healthcare system and how it's strapped considering how my bad habits contribute. Every time I go to work I deal with chest pain, difficulty breathing, drug overdoses, mental health crisis, trauma from many sources but including collisions, scooters, skateboards, assaults, impaired driving, cycling, and many more. Anyone want to take a stab at how much trauma can be averted by just wearing a helmet when appropriate? I'll take Canadian healthcare, thanks :slight_smile:

A friend in Pennsylvania received his healthcare benefits renewal a few months ago. It has increased to $58,000/year for him and his wife. He is semi-retired and without any chronic health problems. His wife is a surgeon and is also healthy. Numerous co-pays remain along with several annual and/or lifetime limits on coverage amounts. If this is what I was faced with, there is no chance I would have coverage.

Oh yes, I don't have any further updates on the router debacle LOL.

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