Philips Hue rooms/groups - not "on" in hubitat without all lights in group on?

I've had this issue for a long time, and it's quite annoying. Seems like HE doesn't pick up that a Hue room or group is on, unless all of the lights in that group are turned on.

Case in point: In my baby's room, I have the Hue dimmer remote set up so that the first on press turns on the table light at a low level, with warm white color, and leaves the ceiling light off. 2nd press turns both lights to 100% at soft white.

Now, the Hue app shows this correctly on that 1st press case (in the room listing, it shows the room as on, with 1 light is on), but HE doesn't seem to pick up any change whatsoever unless I hit the on button again to turn both lights in the room on.

It's not a timing issue, as it can sit like that for hours at a time, and never show as on in HE. Yet as soon as the other light turns on, HE gets the message.

Could this be an issue on the HE side that it is not picking up the change? Or could it be that the Hue bridge is not sending a status update?

Question for you: In the Hubitat Hue App, do you "only" have groups linked or also single hue bulbs? Reason I ask:

There is a minor bug in the Hubitat Hue App. You have to have at least on individual bulb linked otherwise your all of your group statuses won't be updated.... I had the same problem and lost a few hairs over that.

That is something I will have to check on. At some point in the past, I did try to get rid of most of the individual bulbs so as to cut down on device count and hopefully cut down on logging and traffic.

Are you saying that I would just need any single bulb linked in to hubitat, or one bulb from this particular room, on a per-room basis?

I did the exact same thing

Yes, any single bulb. It doesn't have to be in the same room

So it appears that I did have one bulb left over in HE - Kitchen Ceiling A. Still didn't help my Hue group status in the bedroom room. So I did add the desk lamp bulb in the bedroom to HE, and lo and behold, the group status updated when I turned that one light on.

I think there is a little more to it than having a single bulb added from the Hue bridge, and is probably worth having @mike.maxwell or @bravenel take a look at why Hue groups don't update when none of their individual bulbs are added to HE...

Here's the log of my experiment this morning (and the hue app is set up for 10 second polling, so I did give the kitchen long enough to react). You can see that Kitchen Ceiling A bulb was turned on for nearly 1 minute, and the associated Kitchen hue room did not log any change for the duration.

I then added the "color" bulb from the bedroom to HE, and turned the bulb on. Almost immediately (within the 10 second polling time), the associated Hue room reacted in HE:

The magic is in the scheduled jobs. My problem was that the job "poll" was not scheduled unless there is at least one individual bulb configured. It didnt matter which bulb.

You might want to try this:

Go back in the hue app, remove the bulb that you just added, click done and then check the app status page and see if you see the poll entry

it won't update the states if the poll job is not scheduled

Some further details... I've gone ahead and added both bulbs in the bedroom group to HE. Still seeing weird results. Seems to be, if the Ceiling bulb (it's a white ambiance bulb - LTW004) is turned on, it has no effect on the status of the Hue group, even though turning that bulb on shows that the room is turned on in the Hue app.

As soon as I turn on the color bulb (white & color ambiance - LCT014), the group is reflected as on in HE.

If I have both lights on, and turn off the ceiling bulb, the group stays on. If I have both lights on, and turn off the color bulb, the group turns off.

I guess my question is, how is HE deciding what is part of the group? Seems like the ceiling bulb is only kind of part of the group?

If I turn the group on or off, both bulbs respond correctly.

Very strange!

Edit: Also, the scheduled jobs on the bridge seem to be active, just for completeness sake:

And one more note.... I saw the bulbs / groups listed in the Hue bridge status, and the bulb IDs do appear to be correct on the group:

Ceiling bulb:

30={hub=null, modelid=LTW004, name=[redacted] Room Ceiling, id=30, type=Color temperature light, remove=false}

Color bulb:

16={hub=null, modelid=LCT014, name=[redacted] Room Color, id=16, type=Extended color light, remove=false}


6={sensors=[], name=[redacted]'s Bedroom, recycle=false, action={xy=[0.4402, 0.4053], ct=338, alert=none, sat=113, effect=none, bri=244, hue=8672, colormode=ct, on=false}, state={all_on=false, any_on=true}, type=Room, class=Kids bedroom, lights=[30, 16]},

@bravenel any thoughts?

Has this been fixed/is there a good work around? My case is as follows - Ring picks up motion, Alexa Routine turns on virtual switch - hubitat runs a simple automation that says:

If time is between sunset/sunrise turn on 'Porch' Hue Group
then Wait 2mins
Turn off

But Hubitat never updates that the Hue room group is off, so the automation never works again because it thinks the 'Porch' switch is already on - it goes off in the Hue app