Long Range is not so long

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I recently replaced my c7 with a c8 pro. I had some Zooz ZSE41 on outside gates on the C8 set up as non LR and they worked good, using 2 or 3 hops. When I excluded them them included them as LR devices, I found no communication with them unless I was in the same room. I just bought a Zooz zen37 to use as a scene controller in my sunroom (1 room away from the hub's location) and included it as LR. Same thing. It works fine in the hub room, but one room over (about 35 feet), nothing. I also have a Zen34 (non LR) in the sunroom/same location and it works flawlessly. It connects directly to hub @100 kbps.

What could possibly be going on here? My zwave details show these devices as LR, but the performance is not as good as non LR. Could something be wrong with the LR in the hub? Some setting I missed? Hub is on 2.3.9.196. No ghosts.

LR is the main reason for upgrading the hub, so I'm hoping to resolve this.

Any thoughts appreciated.

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I have a Zen71 for my automatic gate and it's around 80 feet away from my C8 Pro.
I was struggling with range in LR as well until I played around with the hub antenna orientation.
Having the correct orientation fixed my LR range issue and loving it.
With just regular Z-wave, I have a sec delay in command.

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I'm guessing the Zwave antenna also handles the Zwave LR, right?

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ya my long range never worked either.. gave up..

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I have a Zooz ZSE41 on my back gate, it's two walls (including an exterior wall) and somewhere over 75 ft from my C8-Pro hub, and it works perfectly.

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To @Navat604 point what is the orientation of your hub and thr antennas. It is my understanding you want the antennas point straig up or down for the best coverage. If the are angled you will get reduced range.

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Z-Wave Long Range, or “LR” is a specification and capability set. Implemented and setup correctly, ideally, it is capable of achieving true long range communication.

Implementation effectiveness of LR is dependent on both the controller (Hubitat in this case) and the device (ZSE41). If either side doesn’t implement the full LR specifications, including transmission wattage levels, the the maximum range promise and potential of LR will not be realized.

Keep in mind that Z-Wave LR is more than “range”, it’s also a communication method, distinct from traditional Z-Wave mesh. It’s a few other new details also.

In addition to implementation, your specific setup also matters, a lot. One of the design principles of traditional Z-Wave is the mesh network that allows communication to work in hops which can extend effective range between endpoints. This is important because that mesh can also work around radio obstacles that direct communication may struggle with.

The ZSE41 is most certainly not operating at LR’s maximum allowed wattage, especially since its on a battery.

In traditional Z-Wave mesh mode (not LR), Hubitat may report direct controller to device communication, but that doesn’t mean that every communication is direct. That report is point in time. Look also at the frequency of rerouting. Z-Wave mesh routing is dynamic. In Z-Wave Details, look for “Route Changes” in the Stats column. It’s really informative for “weak links”.

You can visualize most any stick antenna’s “best reception” as a 3D donut :doughnut: where the stick is poking up (or down) through the hole. The strongest reception will be on the horizontal plane that is the widest part of the donut. If the device radio antenna is on a different horizontal plane such as a different story of a multi-story building, then the most effective reception for those two radios might be to tilt the base radio (Hubitat) donut / antenna to bridge two otherwise horizontal planes. That of course will impact how the base antenna interacts with other device radios, so YMMV.

There best starting advice is straight up or down, but the actual best antenna position is situationally dependent. That’s why it’s adjustable.

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Just excluded this device out of LR and included it as regular zwave. It started working reliably. Same device, same location. I'm starting to think LR is just not ready for prime time yet.

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Maybe it's just Zooz LR battery devices that have less range than non LR. I suppose I should get a different brand and see if it's any better before assuming it is the LR protocol that is the issue.

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i am not sure they are really less but just the fact that they must connect directly to the huib and cannot use any extender you set up. in addition the ones i tried are the tiny battery one (contact sensor) that presumeably has a tiny tiny anteannae and small coin cell battery.

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Funny...I only have one LR so far, but I'm very happy w/my Zooz LR contact sensor. Measured today, and clearly I can't estimate distances as I thought it was 70 to 80 feet from the hub, but it's actuall 140 feet away on my back gate. Communicating through two walls (one exterior with stucco w/chicken wire that can't help). It's been 100% reliable and very fast to register open/close since I installed it.

Def would buy more of the Zooz LR contacts if I have places where I need them, I would categorize my experience w/the Zooz and its LR range as great.

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47 so far. All Zooz. Mostly battery, but also plugs and some switches (more switches on the way)..

I use a Zen34lr as a gate and garage door remote now. Motion sensors in mailbox and package bins. One has been in the freezer for almost a month, but that may not last-we will see.

I still like my plain old Ecolinks though. Big battery and antenna.

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Yeah, I have some of the older GoControl Z-Wave contact sensors w/the CR-123 (think that's it) battery - they last forever.