Is this possible in Room Lighting?

Is this possible with Motion and Mode Lighting Apps?

1 motion sensor, 1 switch.

  • The motion sensor is never aloud to turn the switch on
  • The motion sensor is only aloud to keep the switch on if motion is active
  • When motion is not active for 2 min, the switch should go off
  • When the switch is ON and there was never motion, switch should go off after 2 min

My suspicion is no, but I could be wrong (and looks like I am wrong :slight_smile: See suggestions for the very similar RL App further down). I would suggest looking at trying to do this using Rule Machine.

One possible solution in RM could be to use two rules:

Rule 1:
Triggers: < No Triggers Defined >
Actions: Turn Off Switch - Delay 2 Minutes (Cancellable)

Rule 2:
Triggers: Motion Sensor Changed OR Switch Turns On
Actions: Cancel Actions in Rule 1
IF Motion is Inactive THEN Run Rule 1

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This one won't work with what you want (at least in Motion and Mode). Never motion is an expression and not an event. You would need to use Rule Machine to this piece work.

In fact, looking at all of this, you are probably best using Rule Machine.

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Motion becoming active while the switch is turned on would not result in the switch being kept turned on (and then turned off once inactive).... Not sure how critical that would be... But it is meant to keep the switch on...

Good catch. Clearly I need some more coffee this morning!

Motion and Mode Lighting apps are more or less deprecated. Use Room Lighting. It can do what you want pretty easily.

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Could it do the 2 minute timeout for the switch being turned on? With no motion involved? That's the main reason I went down the RM route. If so, I would definitely agree with using RL instead of the older Motion / Mode lighting apps.

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I don't see how RL can handle his last condition...this works for the first three bullets...but I didn't see how RL can handle the "...switch is on and was never motion..." part. I tested below w/no motion and light turned on via Pico and light did not turn off. RL does not seem to have an option that doesn't require a "motion becomes inactive" event, as opposed to motion just never happens period.

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I thought about masking it with another device to act like a trigger in RL when that happens, but it just get complicated and be confusing to maintain.

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Not that I'm a huge fan of how my two rules turned out in terms of it not being immediately obvious what circumstances are being covered. Notes in the rules would be a good idea in this case I think.

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This is what I came up with after a little bit more coffee. It's not elegant, but should handle all the wants.

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I like that much more than mine..... Nice work. There are so many RM options I have not kept up with.

You use the motion sensor and the switch to activate the app. Uncheck the ‘Act’ column. Set up a timer to turn off after last activation. Limit turning off if motion is active or stays pending.

Bruno doesn't want the motion sensor to activate the switch.... But that may just mean leaving it out of the activation options...

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Or is that why you had this?

That is exactly the purpose of unchecking ‘Act’. And the reason for calling starting the app ‘activate’ rather than ‘on’. As part of activation RL can turn a light on, off, or ignore.

In vacancy mode you want the RL app to start but not turn the light on. Which is the ignore case. IMO the ‘do not activate’ option is a source of potential confusion.

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I already use RM, 4 rules :rofl:
I try to simplify before migrate to C8 :slight_smile:

rule 1

rule2

rule3

rule4

@bill.d 's suggestion for how to do this in Room Lighting, in my book, would be the way to do this.

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Here’s one that is along the lines of what you are looking for. Upon review of one of mine you don’t even need to include the motion sensors in the means to activate, but it also doesn’t matter.

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thx, but I don't see how the switch is turning off after x time when there was never motion.
For example, the Hall upstairs light was switch on at ground level, the sensor is upstairs, but nobody went upstairs