How Does a Dedicated Zwave Extender Work?

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1

I have tried to pin this down, but remain confused about this question.

How does a dedicated, plug-in Zwave extender work? I have two Aeotec 7 extenders on my network and nothing routes through them. Does this mean they are not being utilized or could they be boosting the RF signal in general and strengthening the network that way whether or not they are being used to route for specific devices?

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Personally I use the Ring v2 extenders, they seem more redily active. That said, sometime z-wave devices maintain previously used routes. What you can attempt to do is repair the individual devices to see if it forces a reroute. Another option is to disconnect the hop that your device is going through then power down the hub and unplug it (at the wall not the hub) for 10 mins. Bring it back up and see if the desired device sstarts going through the repeater. (how close is the repeater to that device?) Then bring up the previous mains powered hop.

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I'm convinced that trying to diagnose or control ZW routing is a sure-fire path to madness... Most of my devices go straight to hub, but for the few that hop, those hops can vary mysteriously week to week (or so). I cannot think of any reason why, but they do occasionally hop around.

My RE7s went unutilized for probably a year or so after install, and then suddenly each started to pick up something here & there - I have no idea why. I just placed them around in spots where I figured they could be most useful -- if nothing else, I hope they can be a good mesh backbone in case I have to move other move stuff around etc.

Perhaps this upcoming new ZW SDK will improve routing logic and control, but for now (and for your own sanity!), I recommend just letting it ride.

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4

I tried an Aeotec 7 extender with absolutely NO luck.

I performed a number of tests but the easiest one was:

I had a slow 300 series device that ended up being a repeater for a number of other devices.

I physically removed and replaced it with a Aeotec 7 (of course I lost the dimmer capability of the old dimmer but this was an experiment.)

The devices that had been connected to the remove device would not connect to the Aeotec 7.

I performed a number of tests like this and could never get anything to connect to the Aeotec 7.

Since then there may be firmware updates to the Aeotec 7 and there has been an update to the Hubitat C7 Z-wave radio firmware. So I don't know if my experience is still valid.

BTW Amazon has the Aeotec 7 I could not get to work.

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5

AFAIK z-wave repeaters work the same as any repeating z-wave device, they just don’t do anything else (like control a lighting load).

So if your repeaters aren’t being used as repeaters according to your z-wave mesh details, they’re not really doing anything.

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I have several Aeotec 7 Range Extenders. Several do not have anything repeated through them, but some do. It just depends on what else the devices can go through or whether they can reach the hub directly. I also have an Aeotec gen 5 doorbell that can act as a repeater. Because of its location, a few things go through that.

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There isn't any functional difference between a dedicated repeater and a device which repeats. I'd hope that dedicated ones have better RF sections, at least a better antenna - so should have longer range. The Ring v2 one does offer internal battery backup, which is a difference compared to regular switches/dimmer.

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All radios and antennas have to comply with regulations that limit the radiated power. A device can have a better radio, but then the antenna would have to be less efficient to prevent the radiated power from being too high. A device can have a better antenna, but then the radio power would have to be lower. The later situation is good as it minimizes power consumption, but since repeaters are always line powered, the power consumption is usually not critical. A better antenna can allow the device to "hear" weak signals better.

Before any transmitting device can be sold, the manufacturer submits samples to government agencies such as the FCC for compliance testing. Thus, big differences in RF range are unlikely.

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And yet, there can in fact be significant differences. For the ISM bands, from FCC 15.249, the EIRP limit is 94 dBμV (=50 mV/m).

Looking up the test results for a Jasco/GE ZW3010 Z-Wave Plus dimmer, we find emissions at 87.8 dBμV (@ 908.401 MHz) and 83.8 (@ 916.002).

In comparison, the test results for the Ring Range Extender v2 show outputs in the 93 dBμV/m range.

Apart from the 5-9 dB advantage (which equates to about double the range), the dedicated repeater also gains from not being mounted in a wall box.

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There are many different devices that can act as repeaters. I do not like using devices installed in wall boxes as the proximity to metal boxes and metal conduit (required in my locality) affect the transmission.

My Zigbee repeaters are eWeLink smart plugs that are plugged into wall outlets. My Z-wave repeaters are all plugged into outlets with the exception of a few that I plugged into extension cords to place them in better locations for RF. For example, one of my outlets was behind a heavy desk, so I used an extension cord to place the repeater on top of the desk rather than behind it. In my garage, I used in extension cord to elevate the repeater above the vehicles so it could better serve the garage door sensors.

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11

So the "assumption" folks may erroneously make is all devices are at or near the FCC limit. This clearly is not the case. Note Aeotec markets the extender 7 as "..Range Extender 7 fixes wireless weaknesses...."

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A repeater/range extender can fix wireless weakness only when it is properly located din a position that can be easily reached both by the hub and by the end device. Just like the housing market, location, location, location is the critical factor for the hub, the repeaters, and the end device. I have seen moving a device as little as two feet have a significant effect on performance.

In open air, Z-wave has a theoretical range of 100 meters. However, in a home environment with walls, appliances, furniture, HVAC ducts, electrical conduit, water piping, and mirrors, the range will be far less due to absorption and reflection of the signals.

I assume that most repeating only devices like the Aeotec range extender will be very close to the regulatory emitted power. However, other devices such as wall mounted switches might be significantly less as the primary function takes precedence over repeating capability in the design.

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13

I second the ring repeaters. I have two repeating between the house and the separate garage and they work well. many devices use them.

My aotec repeaters sit in the junk drawer. Never worked worth a damn.

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14

That's where my Aeotec repeaters are now. I replaced them with two ring repeaters. Sometimes the mesh uses them and sometimes it doesn't, but that's still better than never.

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