Frustrated w/ Device Discovery So Far

Hi all, first time poster here. I’m slowly transitioning over from SmartThings (and Wink before that) and I’m running into some real trouble with HE discovering my devices. Here’s a quick note on my layout: my hub sits in my basement and I have dozens of devices (mostly ZWave but some Zigbee) scattered across my basement, 1st floor and 2nd Floor. When I first bought the hub, nothing would pair so I had to have my USB ZWave stick replaced. Once that happened my hub was able to discover my Aeotec Multisensor 6, Fibaro ZWave Plus Button, Generic ZWave Outlet, and one GE ZWave Dimmer Switch — all located in the basement.

It also discovered one GE ZWave Switch, one ZWave Recessed Door Sensor, and two Dome Sirens on the floor above (1st floor).

I’ve struggled to get any of my other devices discovered including: 4 GE ZWave Switches, 2 GE ZWave Dimmers, and 1 GE Outdoor Module — all on the 1st floor, I also couldn’t connect 2 ZWave Motion Sensors and a GE Outdoor Module in my basement level - the same room as the hub.

What could explain this horrendous experience I’m having so far? I hope I’m mkssing something, but I thought I covered all my bases including: exclusion from SmartThings (the device does not show in the web-based API nor the app) and then I reset each device before trying to pair with HE. I started pairing my powered devices first and then moved on to battery powered devices. I also ran ZWave Repair several times - including after each new device was added.

I’ve read that I should either bring the device closer to the hub or use a long Ethernet cord and power supply to bring the hub closer to the powered device. I tried that and no dice.

I contacted HE and they told to wait for the ZWave network to settle, which didn’t seem like helpful advice. It’s also been over a week since that conversation and no change - my devices still won’t pair. They also told me that I should keep the device where it’s intended to be and not relocate to pair it.

Please, does any one see where I could be going wrong here? I really want to like HE, but my experience has been abysmal.

I have ST and Wink 2 as well and I find I have more success with the pairing when having them both off and pair the devices close to the hub. Give the hub enough time to discover the device before giving up and be sure to do Z-Wave exclusion successfully first.

Yeah this sounds like interference to me. We also got your radio back and it tested just fine.
Do the usual. Line devices first from the hub outward. If you can't pair your non secure devices in place then you lack routers or have interference.

Thanks guys. I tried powering down SmartThings also (and of course went through the exclusion protocol). Could the interference be due to the fact that my HE sits next to my router? It’s also near a POI camera and my WiFi printer.

Also, if interference is the issue, is it something that’s an issue only during the pairing process or should I consider moving my HE to a different spot permanently?

That's up to you. But as mike said. Your stick paired up devices in the lab with no issues.

Yes, having it near WiFi will cause issues. Move it across the room or in another room where no 2.4ghz devices are within 3-6 feet.

Pairing does require the device to be at full power. And if lots of rf interference, that increases the noise.

Try to pair a reasonable distance from the hub. There is no reason to even attempt pairing close to the hub, like inches. This is just bad information. Its not needed and can cause other issues.

With zwave, they can be a pain to pair with anything new, especially if they aren't properly excluded or other zwave controllers are on.

Just take it one device at a time. If it doesn't pair right away, just set it aside. Try another. Worst case, reboot the hub and try fresh.

With ZigBee, you can change the channel in settings. Try 25 as it doesn't overlap with WiFi.

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If it helps, when I first received my Hubitat and it was powered up on my desk, I found pairing to be an issue with the first few devices (which were also right next to the hub on my desk). I moved the hub about 6 feet away and pairing was no longer an issue.

I did have trouble with a Monoprice Motion sensor, but the same sensor had issues with my VeraPlus as well so I'm blaming the device or the operator.



Zigbee devices can 'pair in place' as long as they are within range of another zigbee router, or hub. For Z-Wave there are some additional wrinkles depending on what vintage of the Z-Wave device you are dealing with.

Not all Z-Wave devices can be paired 'in place' if their final location is beyond radio range of the hub (even if their are Z-Wave routers close to them). Older devices need to be within one hop ( within radio range including allowances for attenuation of walls, etc.) of the hub to pair. They will not pair through existing Z-Wave routers in your mesh. You have to have the device within radio range of your hub.

The newer Z-Wave Plus standard added 'network wide inclusion' but it requires a Z-Wave Plus router/device (or hub) to be in-range on the initial pairing. A regular Z-Wave (non-Plus) router won't provide this capability on the initial pairing (though running a Z-Wave repair will get all the devices, Plus and non-Plus, to route properly once the new device has been included and relocated).


You'll see lots of message threads, ZWave and Zigbee, about the pairing process. At a very high level, the solutions will seem voodoo. The hard to see element is interference as has already been mentioned.

Your existing hub is a prime example. It's there with it's rado blasting trying to converse with a device you may have inadvertently broken. You remove a device from SmartThings and the device that was relying on that is now unreachable. Eventually it will find a way back, but in the mean time the Radio frequency is cluttered with one or more devices trying to rebuild your ST mesh. 2 mins later, you're trying to pair the device to Hubitat, on the same radio frequency. So you take the advice here and turn off ST hub, and then every motion device or door sensor in your house starts filling the radio frequency with "where are you, my hub?" :slight_smile: as people move about.

I can say all of this from experience. I had my final two devices (Secure only) that needed to move from ST to Hubitat. A Lock and a Garage Door opener. I can't tell you how many fails I had. They would both pair if a foot or two away, but not securely and without secure, it was the same as if they didn't pair. At least as frustrating as you are experiencing, I suspect.

Finally I got it to work and it was like magic!! I removed them from ST, like I had so many times before, and then left them, while I finished emptying out my ST hub, and then powered it off. Then I decided to pair-in-place, to leave the hub where it belongs and to leave the lock or GD Opener where it is bolted down. They both paired correctly, first try!! I cannot say why. Was it not caving into the closeness myth? or was it that I had knocked down some interference by shutting the ST hub? Or did it need both? No way to tell and I'm not gonna jinx it by trying to find out :smiley:

Maybe decide you're going to move a room, move all the line powered devices, none of the battery ones. Put your hub someplace 6-8 feet from anything else electronic.


Pairing zwave can definitely be a PITA. Especially when migrating from another hub. I’ve left my SmartThings hub up and running, with all devices removed, just to use the radio for zwave exclusion. I’ve found that doing the zwave exclusion from the SmartThings hub 2-3 times, and then adding to hubitat has been the most successful. SmartThings zwave exclusion seems much more reliable, plus the app gives immediate feedback.

Also, like @Tony said, older devices have to be able to contact the hub directly. I had to move my hub, pair, move my hub back, and perform a repair to get one old in wall GE switch setup. Zwave plus are definitely much easier to pair.


In addition to what the other guys have said.
If you don’t want to move your hub (I have mine is a network cabinet in the garage attached to my house) then you can always use a usb extension cable.
Mine is on a couple of 10m ‘boosted’ cables which means I can get the sticks (I’m in the UK so have two sticks) near the centre of my home and leave everything in the garage



Guys, this is all such useful advice! Get those radios as central to your home as possible, both vertically and horizontally. Keep radios at least 3 feet off the ground so their signals have a fighting chance.

@Joe.cannarella when I first read your post and you mentioned your hub was in the basement, that was the first red flag. I'm an IT consultant and run into this with consumer clients often here in Toronto. People just don't want to see the devices in their homes, so they put them in a corner of the basement, far from devices on the upper floors. Building materials, pipes, electrical wires and sometimes wire reinforcement mesh under tile floors all contribute to signal loss on the upper floors. This is a primary reason manufacturers are trying to beautify their WiFi routers (I know we're not talking 802.11 here, but we are discussing radio signals), so people will be encouraged to locate them in central or more appropriate places than, on the floor in a closet and such. Some mesh routers even help you locate devices in the best place now.

Signals will do some bouncing, but the bounced signals are significantly weaker because they are absorbed by the building materials, not perfectly reflected. When you decide where to put radio RXTX devices in your home, draw a straight line in your mind's eye from the hub or router to your destination device and consider how many floors, walls, stairs, and other obstructions are in the path of that straight line. All of these will contribute to the attenuation of the signal.

Also consider the size of the antenna that can fit in a dongle, vs integrated into a hub. Not saying that I have any specific knowledge of the difference, between the antenna located in the HUSBZB-1 vs the SmartThings hub, (my ST hub has been sold, so I couldn't compare if I wanted to) but I've read so many accounts of issues that users didn't experience pairing issues with their ST hub, but now experience with the HUSBZB-1 dongle. @Tony has done such a great job of illustrating the other factors that come into play. Many of the users complaining that they see issues they never saw before, didn't have a hub connected at the time ST was first installed, and they probably didn't have that many devices either. So there was little to nothing interfering and their mesh strength only grew over time as they added additional powered devices that could help repeat the signal.

My experience looking at WiFi dongle construction is they have very small antenna, which are usually nothing more than a bit of copper trace on the device's PCB, so I would not be surprised if you will see better results when you have power devices strategically located to repeat the signal. Worse still, you have to know which ones are good at repeating signals and which ones frankly suck at it, or simple don't repeat the signal. For Zigbee devices, Xbee has proven to be a good repeater for several owners, and it lets you view the network topology (My parts are on order). For Z-Wave, I'll refer you to the many posts here and on the ST community about how to deal with it. I have only one Z-Wave device. It's fair to say I'm not a fan of the whole inclusion/exclusion process and the specific requirements. Not that there's anything wrong with it... :wink::beers:


Thanks everyone. Really useful info - many of the steps explained were taken, but I’ve also learned a great deal as well. For example, I had no idea that older ZWave devices had to pair with the hub directly at first (vs. pairing with the mesh network).

I’ve moved my hub one level up, away from my router and ST hub, and I’m finding it easier to pair devices. I’m still struggling with 3 GE ZWave Switches and 1 GE ZWave Dimmer. I’m going to try adding them back to SmartThings again and then going through the exclusion process again. Perhaps they weren’t excluded entirely? It’s the only thing I can think of.

Thanks again for all the productive feedback. I do stress the word productive because the responses that you all shared were clearly thought out based on my situation rather than generic, spammed advice. Thank you all!


It might be easier to perform a factory reset vs include/exclude. This is my go to plan for stuborn devices.

You don’t need to re-join the device to SmartThings to exclude. Exclusion is generic, every controller will do an exclude. But I reinforce Mike’s suggestion that a factory reset is better for stubborn devices.

I don't think there is a factory reset for some of these GE/Jasco switches, at least the common 12722. It's not documented in the included literature, and from a post from someone on the Vera forum
who contacted Jasco support and asked the question (see: GE / Jasco Smart Switch Reset) , there is this:

" Jasco support was clear and concise! The 12722 CAN NOT be put back to a factory reset state on its own. You must use the exclude function from any compatible zwave device. The switch need not have have been part of the network of the device used to exclude it. Since I've tried numerous times to do just that via my veralite without success, Jasco's solution was to replace switches.

So there you have it. No more wasting time trying paddle/air gap combos for a reset that does not exist.

BTW they said to exclude it all you have to do is tap a paddle (either up or down) while your hub is in exclude mode. "

Yes, I can take my battery powered Aeon Z-Stick and put it in Exclude mode, slide it in my pocket and walk around your home clicking switches and exclude everything from your network, pretty much invisibly.

Yeah, this bad boy will exclude the dead, this is a must have for serious zwave enthusiasts...


How does the Minimote compare?

I used the Aeon Minimote for general exclude when I was dismantling my ST Z-Wave network and it worked perfectly for this purpose. It also has a a 'remote inclusion' feature which was more of a crapshoot; it needed some ST hub code tweak before it worked properly. But general exclusion works, regardless of the hub.

Mimi mote works, but it's not as simple as the one button general exclusion you get with the stick.

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