An extra hub?

I'm thinking about another hub to replace my not so smartthingshub, but I am concerned that Hubitat may take the smartthings route to destruction

Why?

Local processing.. once activated you would (theoretically) never have to connect to the internet again - barring a time drift which you can mitigate with the community built NTP device driver.

As long as you have a working system and devices that you are happy with everything should continue to run as long as your hardware holds out regardless of what HE does in the future. If that is the plan then you should probably get 2 hubs and use one for a "just in case" hardware backup..

Hi, for one not so into Smartthings, what would that be? Just out of curiosity

The device is 99% local so that's a big difference. If they change things in a way you don't like, just don't update your device and stay on a version you like.

Otherwise not sure what you're looking for? Can anyone guarantee they won't shut down their cloud servers X years from now? That they won't go out of business ever? That they'll never sell to Samsung or anyone else? That the hub will never have serious bugs that they can't fix? Obviously you know no one can give you those guarantees so...

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Even if they do, others have built local implementations (like how the old SmartTiles dashboards can be installed), so the community could carry on the legacy if it ever did happen :slight_smile:

Sure. Just mean there is always risk. If your hub hardware dies and they don’t make them anymore. Not much we can do!

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Of course :slight_smile: Always open source, after that.

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I would disagree with that estimate. If Hubitat shut down tomorrow, you would lose:

  • Cloud Dashboards
  • Alexa Control
  • Google Assistant Control
  • IFTTT integration
  • Any cloud-based webhooks set-up in custom apps

All of these services run through the Hubitat cloud servers which as a redirect to your hub. And these services would stop working if Hubitat shut down.

Also, don't you need to connect to the internet to activate your hub? I believe that is because it has to register with the Hubitat cloud servers in order to activate. If true, if you had to factory reset your hub you would basically be bricking it.

Also, as far as the community going on....do you really think they would continue to host the discourse server if they shut down? The community would shut down too.

We don't have access to the OS so there is no way to do future development on platform changes. We would basically be stuck using what we had when they shut down.

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If you sign up for cloud services then you have accepted a certain amount of risk anyway...

The dashboard issue can be mitigated by going with a local VPN like WireGuard.

In my case I use Node-RED for most rule related things except for Alexa currently which I run on a separate "control" hub. Am thinking about migrating that over as well.

I realize that this can be a challenge for a non-techical person though.

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What about the registration issue? If you have to factory reset, you're hosed.

And yes, a VPN would work but I don't want tot leave a VPN running on my phone 24/7 and starting one up just to change some settings at home is a PITA.

My point is, Hubitat would no longer be viable if the company shut down. There would be too many things that would stop working to make it worthwhile to use as a device for 99% of people out there.

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It is my understanding you only need to register to register with the cloud services which would be gone anyway, so it's a non-issue.

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I was referring to other solutions---I should have phrased it better. :slight_smile:

Your point is correct. Personally, I have 5 hubs. I'll be good for backups if that time comes :laughing:

I feel I can handle most of what you are saying except for a factory reset.. and why would I ever need to do that over a soft reset / backup restore? For me it's not impossible but just very unlikely and if I ever did I would probably have to go with my backup hub...which has already been activated. Will be doing the same for my upcoming C7 switchover.

The Wireguard VPN I have in place works great - very fast and in fact sometimes I forget I have it activated on my phone. You don't have to route everything through it just the hub(s) of course. Also I am relying more on automation/alerts than remote control so changing things via phone is not all that common a thing for me.

Using the opensource Node-RED allows me to future proof things by being able to integrate many different systems and use the same rules (sequences/flows) etc. Very powerful and flexible.

A little planning goes a long way.. I am confident my system will continue to function even without the internet or HE Inc.

Disclaimer: This is just for my use-case (and my residential clients) and will not be suitable for everyone but it does demonstrate that you should be able to continue to use HE even if the company changes direction or goes away.

My goal is to have HE function as a home appliance like a dishwasher or washing machine rather than a disposable tech gizmo. Sure it may get dated but should continue to function for the duration..

The power went out now Hubitat won’t control my lights!

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Well, if the power is out, how are your lights working? Do you mean the power went out and came back on....?

Since that is a separate issue from the one raised by the original poster in this thread, I would start a new thread.

I think lairdknox was just being sarcastic.

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Yeah, cause sarcastic jokes always come across so well in written text.
(See, that's one example of when sarcasm actually works. Context is key.)

I think the overall point for many of us here is that - yes, while it would be bad it Hubitat the company ever died and went away, that is true for all these solutions (even those backed by large corps as they always kill services or drop support of things), yet out of all of the options, the local nature of Hubitat would probably be the less severe of them all, and the community could step up and fill almost all if not all - the gaps.

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No, I deliberately avoided registering until the whole system was up and running complete with automations, just to prove to myself it really was local. I only registered at the last moment when I was ready to do the Google integration and therefore needed a cloud account for Hubitat. Though it's certainly true I had a big red "nag" icon until I did so. There is a certain amount of pressure to register your hub, which I didn't experience with Hue.

ok. so here is another answer.

As mentioned before, you would lose the ability to register the device, after that you should be good. if they DO shut down for some reason, before that we might be hopeful that they would send a software update that would allow 100% full non cloud activated devices. Pebble did this to their old watches, they gave you a small update and new app that is 100% local to the watch device. that helped people make apps and keep the hardware alive.

  1. a few people mentiond that IFTT and Amazon etc would die. Most likely that is possible, BUT with some creative apps made by some of the amazing dev's here, I bet they could make an app that talks right to Amazon's API and a new skill that would mitigate that.

Remote access, same thing, Sharptools for example could make their own service that would let you talk directly to their dashboard.

These things are all possible. again we have some epic dev's here, this could be ok.

Heck man, people have reversed engineered the old Xbox and you can setup your own Xbox server to play old games with your friends.

At the moment, I don't see HE selling out yet, but you are right, it could be done. But I think how HE setup local processing almost 100% (minus some of the stuff mentioned) that there is little reason for other companies to want to buy them out.

As far as for you to worry? no , I think there is less chance that you have to worry about HE then others.. but there is still nothing perfect in this world.

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