The future direction of Hubitat connectivity

That is the magic sauce, AFAIK. :slight_smile:

I'm hoping that Matter will help resolve some of these types of issues, but as we all know, it's the hope that hurts. :wink:

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Tradfri buttons and motion sensors are easily accessible for me, affordable, and work well, so that's why I like them so much.

The Tradfri stuff and a couple comments from staff that they weren't interested/not a priority is what pushed me to move on.

It came down to either replace everything I already owned (that didn't work with Hubitat) with more expensive gear that does the exact same thing, or find another solution.

It's not fault to the Hubitat team; I didn't do enough initial research and misinterpreted some information on the Compatible devices page before buying, so that's on me.

There are things that I miss from Hubitat, but it's not a whole solution, so it's back in the box for now until I find a use for it.

Love him or hate him (he gets a lot of hate around here) Paul Hibbert touched on this issue in his video today about Ikea gear.

Yeah that's what started me thinking. I love the way Hubitat software works, and I really want it to be more widely recommended.

It is sort of a double standard you set up here. You are saying Hubitat must connect to all these hubs, but these proprietary hubs aren't allowing that to happen. Hubitat is willing for this to happen, but Tuya and their ilk don't publish an API or other ways to accomplish this.

I do think having the USB port on the Hubitat available to newer radios for things like Bluetooth (as awful as it is) or Matter/Thread (IF that ever comes to fruition) would be a good thing. But it is back to the same problem with Tuya, Aqara, and others. There is no USB out on these hubs, so how do you propose to get their closed ecosystems connected to Hubitat?

I can't stand when devices like a thermostat or a garage door is locked into a particular ecosystem. I bet Honeywell, MyQ, Tuya, and others are thinking how smart they are to lock users into their app. Some executive is probably gleeful at having a monopoly on a garage door app.

But there is zero way to hook up a ceiling fan to my Honeywell thermostat app. Or a way to use my MyQ app to turn on the porch lights when I open the door. If these companies really want to expand their userbase, and have mainstream adoption of these smart devices, they are going to have to change their stubborn ways and allow ways to bring in these other systems.

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It is very much "Ikea-like" to make some kit that is easy to put together and modular-ly expandable but not necessarily compatible with what you buy at your local furniture store. I can see somebody back in Delft (yeah, HQ ain't in Sweden anymore) saying, "we need to offer product in this space because it would integrate with other things we want to sell into the efficient home of the 21st Century. BjΓΈrn, go find somebody that can help make this happen for us". Without a lot of deliberate exclusivity as much as "just make it walk-out-the-door simple for our customers".

So unfortunately they have an assortment of stuff that is well priced but some lacking in generic HA usability. Probably more out of oversight/lack of caring than purposeful exclusivity (unless their manufacturer cut corners or tried to maintain the exclusivity).

If only Ikea could get the message that "hey, your stuff ain't bad...tell your outsourced manufacturer to be more attentive to the standards (and things working with other hubs) and you might find it flying off your shelves instead of just sitting there where many Ikea shoppers just pass right by it".

So where does this fit with the topic? I don't think Hubitat should chase too far down non-standard nooks & crannies (thus the decision on Ikea stuff despite the ubiquity of Ikea). The reality is they are going to need to follow some middle course with what the Big Three do so that HE stays relevant.

It's just a shame we can't do better techno-societally to encourage players (with our $) to play well together and leverage the good-of-the-whole vs trying to lock us up in their respective silos. I mean a company could still make a lot of money building a reputation for making really reliable STANDARD ADHERING kit without having to go proprietary.

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If IKEA intends to shift over to Thread along with their new hub then that might make their products easier to integrate with Matter controllers. C9? :wink:

I've only set up a double standard (and I hadn't meant it as any criticism) because Honeywell and Tuya are already high profile brands, while Hubitat is teetering on the brink of getting there and has a delicately balanced decision to make. Or, quite possibly has already made it.

There has to be some sensitivity to the type of player that Hubitat is, in this space. We all have to realize that Hubitat is a relatively small player who has to make serious decisions of where to put their limited resources and where not to put their limited resources.
That said, they do have some "external links" that have been quite successful (e.g. Lutron). There are just not many players out there (as has been previously mentioned) that encourage external linkage via a public api description. Most players want to get you (the customer) into their walled garden - and not make it easy for others to control their products.
Certainly, in my humble opinion, Hubitat should concentrate their resources on those areas that are most popular in the marketplace. So, those players who have the most market penetration should be looked into first, rather than some smaller players.

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This. 100% this. Why the hell does Chamberlain, a flipping garage door opener manufacturer think I'd want my damned garage door opener controlling the house? Same for that stupidly useless American Standard Thermostat!

And Matter? Sorry - look at the list of data collecting companies involved in that! Yeah. No thanks.

S.

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I believe that 95% of the US population that would shop for these products wants very simple phone access to the device, usually via wifi, without any complexity. Look at the number of products that failed to catch on due to needing a hub (evident by all the later products saying "no hub needed" right on the box). People don't read, do research, or understand ecosystems. Instead they buy MyQ and expect it to do basic garage door control without having to buy anything else. If they get home and it requires some other product to be purchased or configured - support calls get made, bad reviews posted, and stuff gets returned.

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Yeah like the people who buy an expansion pack for a game without realising you need to own the base game too :slight_smile:

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That is true for the initial purchase of a "smart" device. But shortly thereafter the user realizes that smart home can do a lot more and they grow utterly frustrated that nothing works seamlessly with each other, thus they came up with Matter, because Z-Wave and Zigbee have been around for a while, so selling something new to show they care about interoperability generates more revenue.

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I agree with you. Ignorant people make bad consumers from one perspective, and good consumers from another.

My point rather, wasn't really about hubs, but the idea that Chamberlain, or whatever embedded home control system is on that American Standard Thermostat, or Nest, or Ring, should be my home hub that's not a hub. As you said, I buy a chamberlain garage door opener for it to open my garage door, and perhaps using open standards talk to my integrated home automation system. But look how every vendor that sells sensors or switches seems to put hubs out that connect to their own sensors and want to be my home automation system (or more scary, my home security system) and don't talk to other hubs, even if they are using open standards like Zigbee and ZWave. Wierd.

Or that it makes any sense whatsoever for the biggest names in data mining on consumers to suddenly jump on board a Zigbee based protocol and start singing Kumbaya!

"In December 18, 2019, Amazon, Apple, Google, Samsung SmartThings and the Zigbee Alliance announced the collaboration and formation of the working group of Project Connected Home over IP. The goal of the project is to simplify development for smart home products brands and manufacturers, while increasing the compatibility of the products for consumers."

Yeah. Hmmm. Glad we got that increasing compatibility in there at the end.

Shennanigans. Yup. Shennanigans.

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I have a friend that does packaging fulfillment (he designs packaging). I am half tempted to get a thousand Zooz zen-16's, and security 2.0 to dry contact button and start heavily marketing them as replacement not cloud needed home automation and start pointing out that manufactures crap. "Want to escape the walled garden? Buy this!"

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Hi Bobby, I registered for the Beta program last week and have not heard back from you. Is there anything else I can do to install and test the beta version?

Hi there thanks for reminding me. I meant to follow up to let you know that I didn't see your request coming through and checked your groups and don't see that you've joined the beta. Mind trying again?

I'm running the latest beta but I only see thirdreality switch and smart button drivers in the device list. Looking for the motion sensor driver. I'm currently using the generic one, which works fine, but I would like to use the official if possible

Hi Bobby, I tried registering in the general beta group. I had already registered in the Canadian group. When I pasted in my hubid and submitted, I received the message: 'You have already requested membership for this group.' so I'm already registered.

The registration info is:

Thank you for your interest in joining our beta testing program. Please provide us with your Hub UID:

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

Note: if selected, your hub will be enrolled in the next beta opportunity upon membership approval.

You should delete your hub ID from your public post.

@bobbyD

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Thanks! Just did.

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