Starting fresh, what would you buy?

Ha! That's the second time this morning when you've pipped me to the post :grin:

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Thanks guys :slight_smile:

Other than range and device limit, are there any other reasons to choose RA2 over Casseta?

RadioRA2 also supports some pretty nice, albeit expensive, keypads. I also believe that RA2 “Occupancy Sensors” can be integrated with Hubitat...whereas Caseta occupancy sensors do not report their status over the Telnet interface.

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I am most of the way outfitting a new home from scratch and would echo the Lutron + Zigbee advice above as very reliable.

I would also add to the above comments that I very pleased with the Yale SL Assure locks with the Zigbee module. And big shoutout for @ogiewon and his Harmony Hub integration which ties in my home theater equipment... very solid and quick.

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For Lighting I would advise three different options. Each option has its unique benefits so choose the one with the features you find most important. Note each option listed below I consider to be rock solid they just always work.
Lutron - Clear Connect RF, Unique look for switches, Pico remotes, and no-neutral required on dimmers.
Inovelli - Notification light bar on switches programmed however you want (lightbar is red when alarm is on, blue when the seahawks are winning, etc...), no-neutral required on dimmers, easily the best fan switch if you only have one wire between the switch and the fan (ac fans only).
Ge/Jasco - Look almost identical to a standard toogle switch (can be good or bad depending what you are looking for), integrated motion sensor option with switches and dimmers.

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True. Although the newer Caseta dimmers do require a neutral. With the older no-neutral dimmers, some low wattage loads (like LEDs) would require wiring an in-line Lutron MLC.

Besides keypads and motion sensors there are a couple other things that RadioRA 2 offers. 1) Maestro style dimmers/switches. The single toggle with a level bar is far more aesthetically pleasing IMO, and 2) the physical device 'on' button is programmable to previous or preset level. Caséta always comes on to 100% using the physical dimmer control.

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I'm also looking to "start fresh" using a Hubitat. This will be my first foray into home automation.
Until now, I've been content to watch from the sidelines because many of the "Top 10 Home Automation" threads/videos I've seen have are packed with "trivial" things you can do with your lights, start your Roomba, etc. With a robust logic engine, an abundance of supported sensors/devices, and the the security of being locally driven, I'm finally going to take the plunge.

Based on the discussion here, I'll probably pass on smart lighting for now (can't justify $50 or more just to turn a light on/off). However, I haven't seen any specific recommendations for the other zigbee components. If anyone has thoughts on the following, I'd sincerely appreciate the help.

Basic smart plug for turning cord-connected items on/off.
Advanced smart plug for power monitoring
Door/window/temperature/tilt/etc. sensors. Better to use a universal or separate switch for each function? Recommended models?
Some type of button/switch to trigger routines, etc.
HVAC Thermostat
Presense detection (fully locally driven preferred)
Motion sensors
Anything else...?

Thanks in advance!

Lutron

Given the current state of things I personally will stay away from zwave. Apparently there are too many devices that actually aren't as compliant as they should be.

Hubitat likes to keep things clean and usually will not add patches for such devices.

Guys I appreciate all the advice and am impressed with how much support Lutron is getting from this crew. Unfortunately the cost per switch is over double the cost of the GE zigbee switches. The new house I'm buying is over 6k sq/ft and well over 75 switches. That would cost a small fortune. I think I'm going to have to stick to the GE dimmers this time around.

A 6,000 sq. ft. house is going to be a big project to set up no matter what standard you use. That's a large enough house to consider using a pro lighting designer. As you've noted you're going to have over 75 devices. So in a Lutron system you'll need multiple Caséta systems or a single RadioRA 2 system probably with multiple main repeaters. Using Zigbee or Z-Wave you will need to design a large mesh that performs well. It's possible you would need multiple Hubitat hubs to handle multiple meshes.

Yes, Lutron can be expensive. But so is time. In Chicago and other major metro areas a 6,000 sq. ft. home is well over $2m. Spending low 5 figures for a RadioRA 2 system is not that much to add. Once it's working it is more or less bullet proof. If you are pricing out a RadioRA 2 system and are doing a self install you can get bids from multiple electrical supply houses, including on-line retailers. They will compete for your business and will be significantly below MSRP for such a large project.

Good luck!

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That is my main problem with Caseta. A friend or elderly family member visiting will look at that switch and have to spend a moment figuring out 'wtf?' ... or using it unseen, by feel (eg reaching for it from around a corner, or in the dark) it is not very clear how to operate it.

If they would just make a regular rocker-style switch format I'd be way more into them. The Inovellis are a much better user experience for someone who has never even heard of the smart-home concept. They just walk up and use it without thinking.

So long as you are on-board with the non-standard design, and having another hub in the overall system, they are amazingly high quality, don't need a neutral, etc.

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I hear you... however I have never found that to be the case. People have no problem using Caseta light switches and dimmers. I have never had to explain their operation to anyone. Also, if you've truly automated your home, end-users should rarely, if ever, need to even consider touching a light switch.

When we travel, my whole family always comments on how they now just expect bathroom lights to turn on automatically - it is quite a 'hassle' to have to touch a light switch! :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

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Totally agree on the automation aspect. It is gratifying when they make observations like that :smiley:

If that case, I would probably mix Inovelli and GE/Jasco. They are both zwave plus repeaters and this would be the foundation for a very robust zwave mesh. I would use the Inovelli for switches, dimmers, and fan. And use the GE/Jasco wherever you wanted a switch/dimmer with built in motion sensing.

I personally believe that if @kerrylebel is not going with Lutron, then sticking with Zigbee switches and dimmers is a pretty good plan. I find Zigbee to be much more reliable than Z-Wave. One has only to look at the number of issues Z-Wave users are having in the forum... :wink: I know things have been getting better, but I am avoiding Z-Wave as much as possible. Thus, my reason for using Lutron and Zigbee for everything in my house. It has never been more stable or automated.

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There is just not a lot of selection for Zigbee switches. If you want a switch with built in motion sensing, or light bar notifications, or the need to not have a neutral you are going with Zwave.

I will stand by my earlier statement that both Inovelli and GE/Jasco zwave plus switches will give you a 100% rock solid lighting system. There are many zwave lighting users that have had an equally robust experience as the experience of Lutron users. By equally robust I mean: Always works, 100% of the time, it has never once gone down.

If you use Lutron and Zigbee for everything in your house, how are you determining the reliability of your zwave devices, you don't have any?

I'm big on multi-function and built-in devices. Until someone else makes a dimmer/switch with built in motion, I am sticking with the GE Z-Wave Motion Dimmers.

I used to have Z-Wave switches and dimmers... and I had issues with them from the day they were installed. Albeit, they were older models. I replaced them all with Lutron and have never been happier with a home automation purchase decision.

Another potential issue (for a very large home installation) with Z-Wave is the 232 device limit, as well as 4 hop limit. Zigbee has neither of these restrictions.

I completely agree that Z-Wave offers more variety, features, etc... I just choose to follow the KISS principle and believe reliability is much more important than blinky-lights. :wink:

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