Rule Machine Enhancement Request For Consideration

I would like the community's and developer's thoughts on the idea of being able to sort RM rules. I am increasingly struggling with finding rules as the list continues to grow. I have changed the naming structure several times and finally landed on starting them with the location. That fits a good bit of the time but still is very limiting. Some rules are by functions, some are trigger, some by time, etc. See below.

Location:


Function:

I believe it would be extremely helpful to have the capability to sort the RM list via a dropdown list populated by the hub owners. The RM list could only have one value selected at-a-time. See below:

The RM list values would come from the rule with the values being added when the rule was either created or edited. See below:

The would provide the ability to provide multiple "views" of the rules based on the sample list provided or any view for that manner the hub owner decides to populate in the rule list that is shared across all RM rules without the need to try and force views in the naming conventions of the rule itself; which for me, has always never fit.

I know the developers are busy but would really like for them to see this request as well and don't know how to make that happen. Is this something a moderator would do?

As always appreciate the community's feedback.

  • Don

Have you tried the filter at the top of the apps page? Why sort when you can filter?

4 Likes

I have, but I have not been able to filter on the data points like in the example. Am I missing something? Is there a way to do that in the filters?

Not for the tags, unless you use naming conventions (this is how I handle it now). I also do not think that the Rule notes are searchable. So, point taken.

I have always just had a habit of using a naming convention - Main Devices (or types)- Function - Room or location (if needed). I think someone else a while back mentioned they used emojis in the names to filter and sort.

I guess my question is (for understanding, not sarcasm) - how would it be less difficult to make tags in the rule than to just put them in the names?

I kind of follow the idea of having tags, but I can't wrap my head around why you would sort by tag rather than search by tag.

Devices already have tags that can be set from a user-configured list, so it doesn't seem like a huge leap (easy for me to say) to allow multiple user-configured tags for rules.

That's a good point. I started using some Emojis in device names (all Room lights have a lightbulb, all hub-mesh linked devices have a chain link) just to make it visually easier to spot the type, but you can also search by Emoji. In the absence of tags for rules, a few Emojis in the name would be a space-efficient way to tag rules. Still wouldn't do much for sorting, but it would make searching and visual scanning easier.

1 Like

Good point. You could achieve the same result by putting the tags in the title but that may make the title pretty encrypted at some point versus the title remaining more readable in a sentence form to others in the household who are not actually coding the rule. Would much rather family members be able to understand living room lights off, dining room fan on, etc.

I do like the ideal of emojis for fast visibility of their functions, but I don’t know that emojis would be available for every function that may be needed to describe what is needed to be documented.

I use an emoji as the first character of my rule names to sort the rules in groups: lights, doors, modes, temperatures, etc. I try to make the name of each rule very descriptive. For example: ":zap: Ecobee — Change set point if windows or doors are open" or ":house_with_garden: Mode - Home from Away". I don't use tags. If the rule is complex or I might forget why I did something in a particular way, I include a note.

3 Likes

I use emojis myself. But there is a community app that does exactly what you are looking for. I do not use it.

5 Likes

Thank you! I don't know how I missed this one :-).

I will check this out over the weekend.

  • Don

Appreciate the "plug". And just why aren't you using it?? JK.

App author here. Let me know how it works for you; and if you have any suggestions/comments/ideas.

2 Likes

:laughing: I throw that in so I don't get any follow up questions, that I will not be able to answer :rofl:

1 Like

Will do!!

Good afternoon everyone,

As noted in my previous reply, I wanted to follow up after trying the Rule Machine Manager app. It works GREAT! Not once did the app abnormally end, hang, or anything along those lines. Even after creating multiple containers, creating many duplicate rules, and moving the rules many times in and out of containers. At first I was a bit "concerned" about losing my work and would save ever 3 minutes or so. After awhile I stopped as I became very comfortable with the stability and reliability of the app.

I tested renaming, adding, and deleting rules inside HE. All changes were reflected in Rule Machine Manager once you saved the app, exited, and re-loading the app.

Observations:
The only strange observation I noticed after about 5 hours of using the app was when selecting multiple rules. When holding the CNTL key and selecting more than 4 or so rules (no consistent number) the highlighted selections would un-highlight and the rules would be moved all together within the same container I was working in vs. giving me the opportunity to move them to the intended targeted container. Not detrimental in any sense. All was necessary was to re-select them (all now adjacent at this point) and move them to the target container. This was the only unintended consequence that occurred while using all the functions.

Suggestions:
Note: These suggestions comes with me being an early user of the app. Some may or may not make any sense. Some may show my lack of experience, knowledge and understanding of how I should have been doing something :slight_smile:

  1. Provide a way to delete all of the duplicate rules (children) of the parent rule at one time. Currently the duplicate rules are identifiable by a trashcan. You need to look for the duplicate titles of the rule and the associated trash can icon. If the rule has been duplicated multiple / many times this can be time consuming and opens up a margin of error. I believe it would highly desirable if you could select the parent rule (identifiable by a double-page type icon vs. a trashcan), select it, and have the a ability to click on delete all duplicate rules.

02 Have individual options to (1) sort all containers and (2) sort all rules within containers. Although there is an option to sort the rules within a container you have to go to each container and do it individually within each container one-at-a-time. This would eliminate a fair amount of time dragging containers in alphabetical order and having to use the sort option on each set of rules individually with containers.

03 Have the ability to search across all contains the same way you can currently search within a single container

04 Have the ability to toggle on / off the "are you sure you want to delete" message. During setup or mass manipulation of rules during setup this does get in the way pretty quickly (at least with the number of rules for me during my initial configuration). Given the "operator" the option to toggle on / off might be a nice option.

Summary:
What I ultimately needed to accomplish when I made my initial suggestion for tags in Hubitat rules was far exceeded by this app. That being the ability get a cross-categorization of my rules so I could quickly identify what functions a device may be control by. I was highly desirable for me to achieve this without having the title being any more that the location and a simple description of what the rule does. This was important so that others in the house (other than I who developed the rule) understood what it does (oh yeah me too as I get older and sometime don't revisit a rule for 8 months lol).

Please note the re-naming of the rules have not yet occurred achieve to remove everything but the location and the description. Ran out of time today. The final step will be to rename the rules with examples being:

OLD - Dining Room Ceiling Fan - Manual Even [Fan Off]
NEW - Dining Room Fan Off

OLD - Kitchen Room Lighting - Scheduled Event Lights On Daily [15:00] Off [07:46am]
NEW - Kitchen Room Lighting - Lights On Daily [15:00] Off [07:46am]

OLD - Living Room Lights - Motion Detection Lights On
NEW - Living Room Lights - Lights On

OLD - Mailbox 4900 - Triggered Event Open Detection
NEW - Mailbox 4900 - Open Detected

OLD - System - Health Check [Virtual Network Ping Critical]
NEW - Virtual Network Ping Critical

Kitchen - Refrigerator Monitoring Commercial Power Lost
Kitchen - Refrigerator Commercial Power Lost

Living Room Lights - Motion Detection Lights On
Living Room Lights - Lights On

Device Cross Functional View - Computer Room EPO Switch:
Button Controllers
Emergency Power Off Rules
Triggered Rules [Event]
Triggered Rules [Manual]
and if cross container search is implemented can be easily be located across containers to include items in button controllers. Items in Button Controllers is already available for Container View they just cannot be searched on across containers (to my knowledge).

Interface Screens:
NOTE: I tried to provide a way to convert my captured .mp4 to an acceptable Hubitat movie format of webp, avif, or other format. After a good bit of time I had to move on and just did the standard screen shot approach. If you enlarge and scroll you will get a sense what the interface looks like with my data loaded.












  • Don
2 Likes

Sounds like you've found a great solution.

Suggestion: You might want to move the parts of this message that are your detailed observations and suggestions about Rule Machine Manager to the Rule Machine release thread so the conversation w/@joshlobe can continue there in that context, other users might chime in, and the useful content is then easily found/tracked in the app release thread.

Glad you found/like Rule Machine Manager, I also believe it is a very cool app.

Still learning so much.

Absolutely will. Thank you.

  • Don
1 Like

Just tried to add to the release thread. Unfortunately looks like it auto-closed 365 days after its initial open.

  • Don

I'll get it opened.

1 Like

Ok, the topic has been unlocked. :slightly_smiling_face:

2 Likes

I just added them. Thank you so much.

Enjoy your evening!

  • Don
3 Likes