Migrating to C8 from Vera, PIRZWAVE2.5-ECO motion sensors not staying connected

I've had the PIRZWAVE2.5-ECO sensors for years, I recently tried an Ezlo hub and migrated from Vera hub, they were working fine. I decided to try the Hubitat C8. I am able to reset the devices and include them to the hubitat. they work fine for about a day, and then they just stop. The hub became unreachable once so far, i rebooted by removing power. I'm not sure if this is a hub or firmware issue. As I stated, the motion sensors worked fine with both the vera and Ezlo controllers. I am using the Room Lighting App with some plug in dimmer modules and a dimmer in wall switch. Any help would be appreciated as I'm trying to evaluate if I will stay with Hubitat.

Because you're new to Hubitat, advice here may take you on what you might se as a "Grand Tour" -- it's just a lot of people want to help. :slight_smile:

I'd start by looking at your ZWave Details page (Settings: ZWave Details) ... here's an example of what you might see:

The Stats column has some useful data. I picked this one because it's not ideal.. but is working.. who needs to see a "perfect" example, right? :slight_smile:

RTT Avg of 38ms is high. It's quite common for it to be in single digits.. 4ms to 9ms. Thus "lower is better". Neighbor count of 1 in my example is not good either. One would want at least 2. Looking at the right (Route) column, my example indicates it's a direct connect (01 is the hub itself.) Which then makes the neighbor count of 1 a lot more acceptable. :slight_smile:

What does yours look like?

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First off, thanks for replying. It's not allowing me to attach a screen shot, is that because I'm new?

it says i can't embed media items in a post?

Yep, you need to join the Owner group, new users have reduced permissions for spam reasons.

https://community.hubitat.com/g/owners

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Thanks...

I've only set up two rooms so far, I don't want to proceed if I can't get these working.

Your 2nd row is missing a Route.

Ordinarily we see those and think: "Ghost" -- meaning a device that only partially Joined.

Also, normally, we see the next device is a match/duplicate of the ghost and thus tells us you got a failed Join and then tried again, and succeeded on the 2nd attempt. You don't have that, but it maybe you just haven't noticed yet. :slight_smile:

Next I'm going to focus on the last row:

Notice that there are Remove and Replace buttons that don't exist anywhere else. That means the Hub has detected the device no longer exists. Could be powered off, or out of range of everything. But it isn't good either.

Can you tell us more about those two devices?

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Ok, the first is a dimmer lamp module. I'll unpair it, and add it again.

the second is the motion detector. I can get these working short term by removing the battery and reinserting it.

I didn't do the batteries in the motion detectors today in case someone needed to see what it looked like when it's not working.

I'll resend the screen once i've done the actions above.

:trumpet: :trumpet: :trumpet: I don't think you'll have any problems running them on a C8, however, one major difference between your former controllers and Hubitat Elevation may be that you are comparing the performance of an established mesh with, perhaps solid repeaters, against an underdeveloped Hubitat mesh. I suggest building your mesh's backbone first, then try adding the battery operated devices. Doing it right from the beginning will pay off in the long run.

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I continue to advise people to use the following method to Join devices to their Hub:

  1. Put the hub into Exclusion first and then click the device to get it to start an Include/Exclude. You should see a message: "unknown device excluded" This step lets you know that the hub and device can, in fact communicate. You cannot create a Ghost using Exclude. If you don't get the message, try moving the two closer then try this step again. Do not move to the next step until you get the message.

  2. Put the hub into Include and click the device to get it to start an Include. It will take longer to Include as the hub detects the device and exchanges values.

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Ok, all is working again for now. I readded the Lamp module and pulled the batteries on the two motion sensors. If this is like the past few days, they will work for 6 to 8 hrs and then stop responding.

Well it's the same issue again today... The zwave screen looks ok...

However you can see no activity since this morning....

How do I get any actual technical support from Hubitat? I find this odd that I can only get help from other users.

You got a response from @bobbyD 3 messages up.

I think it would be great though, if trumpets sounded each time Hubitat staff jumped in on topics :smiley:

Most of the assistance here contains a lot of 'parroting' of messages we've seen Bobby and the rest of Hubitat's staff say. In other words we read Bobby's excellent response a year ago, remember it, and parrot it back. :smiley: If we get it wrong, they will teach us. :smiley:

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:trumpet:

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Bobby, I get what you are saying, but considering this is your new C8 with external antennas and the 6 devices are within 16 feet from the unit, and 4 of them are plug/wired devices, I don't find this much of a solution. The motion sensors work, but only for 6 to 8 hours and then they stop responding. I've had Zwave devices for over 10 years using Vera controllers with most issues were fixed by myself, however, when there was an issue that I couldn't fix, there was a direct support email/phone line. I did the exact same thing when I tried the Ezlo Secure hub, and yes, with only 6 devices it worked fine. The difference is, when one on the motion sensors didn't configure right, Ezlo/Vera Support connected to their Hub and spoke to me on the phone to get it fixed.

I will proceed, but I'm very concerned that without examining logs or checking the unit, that the only solution is to add more devices and build up my zwave network.

So to be specific, how many plug/wired devices would you say are required to make these battery operated devices stay working, despite the Zwave status page saying they are "OK" ?

Each environment can be very different, so finding the right mix of end devices/repeater greatly depends on building materials, location of the hub, quality of the radio in the devices used, etc. My go to ratio is generally 6 end devices / 1 repeater. But again, what works for some may not work for everyone.

End devices that stop working after a period of time is indicative of a weak mesh. If all your devices would stop working, then we would be addressing that issue in private, looking at your hub's engineering logs.

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Well I'll try it, though the Ezlo was working fine with these 6 devices. I really hope this works, because it's quite a bit of work excluding/including. To be honest, so far, this is not the beginning of a beautiful relationship lol

I'll add the kitchen, about 20-25 feet away from the hub, and the Foyer and Foyer bath, also about 25 feet. That will bring the numbers up to 12 wired/plugged devices and will add 3 more of the same motion sensors. Not to sound like a broken record, these are all functioning fine for two weeks with the Ezlo. If I'm still dealing with the same issue, then I would hope to get some real assistance, or it's off to try the Homey Pro. :wink:

Will report back soon.

bobbyD, I did as you suggested last night, I added additional wired/plugged devices including three repeaters. All was working well last night. When I got up today, the same situation, the motion sensors are not reacting. I tested one device directly, and it works by manually turning it on, so I think it is just the motion sensors. I'll attach the Zwave details screens below.




Please let me know what are the next steps to get this and keep this working.

OK, really bizarre, as i mentioned I turned on one of the lamps manually through the dashboard while I was sending the last message. When I was done sending the message i noticed the other family room light went on. I checked the dashboard, and you could see the two lights and the motion sensor had tripped. So I walked around the first floor and the motion sensors tripped and the lights came on in the various rooms.

So, it appears that the Hubitat was "asleep" until i turned on one of the lights, I have no idea. This is really odd. Is there some setting I'm missing which would make the Hubitat unresponsive until some action was taken like turning on the light? or is this something else all together? any help would be appreciated.