Migrating from C5 with USB z-wave stick to C8 fails

Attempting to migrate my C5 to a brand new C8, and it's not working.

C5

  • Current version: 2.3.5.152
  • Static IP address assigned in router
  • Registered user email does not contain '_' character
  • Pinging cloud.hubitat.com using the Network tools succeeds
  • Clicked the Create a cloud backup for C-8 migration button - this seems to create a backup, but it has no size reported, nor are there any buttons (so I cannot delete it).
  • Shut down the device

C8

  • Current version: 2.3.5.152
  • Connected via ethernet using DHCP
  • Pinging cloud.hubitat.com using the Network tools succeeds
  • Registered to the same user email as above (with no '_' character) - I can see both hubs against the account

On the new hub, I go to the "migrating from another hub" link, and I can see the cloud backup. This time it has file size. I tick the "read the instructions" box, click the Migrate button. The progress spinner spins for a minute or so, and then a "failed to migrate" error pops up.

I've never experienced this but as a wild guess, I'd say the initial cloud backup was incomplete. The C-8 couldn't do anything with it.

I'd power down the C-8 and power up the C-5 and re-attempt the cloud backup.

I've only had an opportunity to try one Migration and it worked flawlessly, first time for me. Meaning I didn't have to overcome any issues. :slight_smile:

@support_team

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This is my third or fourth attempt at migrating. Each time, I have to create a new cloud backup, and each time, it never seems to complete.

EDIT: Oddly, having rebooted the C8, I can see all my devices and apps/code, but nothing is showing in the z-wave details pages. And no devices work.

The Cloud backup contains a "regular" DB backup PLUS the Z-Radio backups. They get restored like that too and you have to click/select which ZRadio backups to restore.

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Shutdown and unplog the c8 for 2 mins and power back up.

If it fails to migrate, then that explains why Z-Wave Details page may be empty. It sounds like the problem is on the C5. Are both radios enabled and functional? Have you been having Z-Wave or Zigbee issues? The migration process only works if the source hub is functioning properly.

Powered down for 15 minutes. No z-wave details are showing up:

It was functioning fine as of just prior to shutting the C5 down. I'll fire it up again and check all the devices.

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Fired the C5 up again. Both z-wave and zigbee radios are fine, and devices are responding as expected.

Zigbee

Z-wave

One thing to note, the zigbee sonoff contact sensor is currently offline - could that have an impact on the backup?

@bobbyD - Since this user appears to be from the UK, and has a C-5 hub, might the model of the external Z-Wave radio have something to do with the migration issues? Just a hypothesis, as I do not know the specifics of which C-5 Z-Wave radios qualify for the migration process to the C-8... :thinking:

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I am indeed based in the UK.

I've fixed the sonoff contact sensor, and it is reconnected to the zigbee network:

I've also checked every z-wave device, and they are all responding correctly. However, attempting to generate a backup still results in an incomplete state:

That's a good point. The C-5 had external ZWave USB sticks for non-USA frequencies. Zigbee used the Internal radio, but if I remember right, only the C-7 was able to read Zigbee. C-8 has read-write, obviously.

Zigbee manual migration is a nuisance but not hard. You put the hub in Zigbee pairing and then click/tap/push the buttons on the Zigbee device and it will be found and drop right back into the slot.

ZWave is more complicated, but the "recipe" has been documented.

There's only 3 zigbee devices, so a manual migration is not too onerous. The z-wave devices, on the other hand, are an entirely different ballgame. I really Really REALLY don't want to have to manually add them again.

Is there a link to the "recipe"?

If the ZWave USB stick installed on your C-5 is white on one side and grey on the other, that manufacturer did not produce sticks that are readable. Some parts of the world got a ZWave USB stick that is all black and is readable.

Because of Murphy's Law, I'm going to guess you have the white/grey Nortec UZB stick and will have to do a manual migration. I've done two of them and it's tedious but not hard.

You start by thinking about it and making a plan. The issue is to prevent overlapping ZWave DNI.

On your C-5, start by counting the total number of ZWave devices that you will be migrating. Let's use "30" for this example. Look at Settings: ZWave Details and notice the Node numbers.

The first device you manually migrate to the C-8 will join as Node 6. (Nodes 1-5 are reserved.) You don't want to have an already existing Node 6. Same with the next..

If there are 30 devices to migrate, and you follow the Exclude-before-Include advice, you will Join the last device with a Node of 36. Which means you need to plan out how to prepare the C-8 for those first 36 Node IDs. You're going to migrate from the C-8 outwards, powered devices before battery devices, so the numerical order on the C-5 isn't important. Snap a picture of those first "30" devices so you can find them in the next step, by Name.

Power off the C-5 and power on the C-8. In Devices, go through all the ZWave devices and put "old" at the end of each name. If that device IS PART of the "30" to be protected, put a "x" at the beginning of the DNI (click edit to change it) and save the device. You will "touch" every Zwave device in the list adding old to the end of the name AND maybe adding an x to some DNI's.

Now migrate your devices one at a time. When it's time to name them, use the original name. Then, after testing the new device to confirm working in Device Info, use Settings: Swap Apps Device.

Select the device with "old" in the name on the left, select the new device on the right and click Swap old device in all apps This will do exactly what it says, it will move all the InUse by items at the bottom of the old device to the new device. You can now delete the "old" device.

Rinse, repeat. Note that the "protected" devices have a DNI that is invalid and thus it won't delete immediately. Click Force Remove for those. (This is why my advice is to protect only the first "30" because for non-overlapping Node IDs the Remove goes quickly, no Force required.)

NOTE: replace "30" in this advice with your Actual number. For me, I found I had very few overlaps. Over time, I had replaced older devices with new and thus the old low Node numbers no longer existed. In one case I had 28 devices to move and there were zero devices between Node 9 and Node 41 and so I only had to "protect" those first few.)

This is what "old" is doing for you...

Which one is the "old" device?? They are both in the list with the same name. By starting the process with renaming all the devices you know you're going to delete, you make the Swap Apps Devices process a lot simpler.

I learned this process during my first migration... and you can be assured I learned the hard way about overlapping DNI. The last half of the first hub and all of the second hub I migrated went very smoothly when I followed this method. :slight_smile:

The ZWave stick is all white, Silicon Labs brand, Serial: SLUSB7000A UZB-7.

And just to clarify, I use the devices on the C8 that partially migrated?

I assume so, because at least all the apps and rules seem to have been copied across.

I think you guys need to update the migration wiki page for non-US users who are likely to be affected by this issue.

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That's a fair point, we just need to "import" some more content from the original migration document under Hub Protect wiki.

So, having spent the day reconnecting a bunch of my old devices, ensuring that the node IDs weren't overlapping, replacing the "old" devices, I find that the C8 is incredibly slow when trying to turn on/off z-wave devices.

I have mostly Quibino flush relays, all located in the exact same spots as before. The C8 is in roughly the same position. Devices take 3+ seconds to respond, and after the first click on a button via the webpage, they won't respond to subequent commands (or commands take 10+ seconds to respond). Sometimes refreshing the webpage, and then hitting the button again works.

It's now gotten to the point where I am unable to connect any more z-wave devices (although that could be the qubino relays playing up, as I've had a lot of trouble getting them to include/exclude).

I have done various reboots, shutdowns-power offs, individual z-wave repairs, and a full mesh repair. I left the mesh overnight to settle: most devices are one or two hops and reporting 100kbps (which was better than yesterday), but are still incredibly slow to respond. The status information for the devices rarely matches the actual state (e.g. the on/off state).

So far, massively unimpressed with the C8, and a trawl of the forums shows I'm not the only one with this issue.

I've decided to factory reset the device and start from scratch without migrating, and use an ethernet connection instead of wireless to see if that makes a difference.

If this fails, it's going back to the shop and I'll be going back to my trusty C5.

Can you please post your z-wave details page in its entirety?