Messed Up My Z-wave

My C8 had been working fine. I had a Z-wave device that I wasn't using and decided to remove it. I could not get it to go into exclusion mode. Finally did a force remove. Now I have a bunch of my Z-wave devices not working. If I hit refresh on the device in the Z-wave list it goes to pending. And they don't work. I tried a Z-wave repair and that didn't work. I was running 105 on the hub so I updated to 113. Didn't help.

What do I do now?

I've had similar issues excluding devices since migrating to the C8. What you might try is power down your hub for a minute, fire it back up, let it sit for a minute, and then try refreshing the device until you get a "remove" button. Make sure the original device is still unplugged. If that doesn't work I'd give it overnight and try again.

But power down gracefully, via shutdown in settings.

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And your device still thinks it's included so if you decide to use it again you have a couple options... if you have a spare C7 you can try excluding it with that, works for me every time. Or you can do a factory reset on the device. (Just make sure if you use a C7 it isn't the one that you migrated from - or at least the z-wave radio is reset and the zigbee radio is on a different channel.)

I somehow managed to get it back in the Z-wave list. But it won't do anything. Tried again to do an exclusion, but that still doesn't work. Tried doing an inclusion, nothing there either. I don't have a C7 so can't do that. I do have a c5 I guess I can try that. But if the device is still shown in my C8 how would that work?

Two separate issues. Excluding the device on your C5 simply tells the device it is unpaired and free to pair with another hub. It won't help the situation on the C8.

I give up. Using my C5 I can't get it to include, exclude or anything. I have done the factory reset which doesn't seem to work.

I did another force remove on the C8. It no longer shows up in the device list, but in the Z-wave list it shows up as not responding with Discover in the device name field. It does appear that all my other devices are ok now, so I guess I'll not worry about it.

When I did firmware updates on my Aeotec 700 range extenders, I ended up with a lot of ghost devices. I was expecting that, so I purchased a Zooz Z-wave 700 USB dongle to remove the ghosts using the Silicon Labs software. Zooz now has an 800 series dongle.

The Hubitat hub is supposed to be able to remove ghost devices without needing the dongle and software. Try removing the ghost using the C8 hub or even your old C7 hub as recommended by @brad5, but in stubborn cases, the dongle might be your best option.

How do you remove a ghost using the C8 hub? I don't have a C7, just a C5. Certainly don't want to purchase a dongle.

On the C8 if it shows up as "discover" see if you can do a refresh a couple times and get that "remove" button to appear.

I can never get the remove button to appear. Hit refresh many times.

If you cannot remove the ghost using the C8, you might not have any option but to purchase a dongle. They are not all that expensive. I do not keep my 700 series dongle plugged in, but reserve it for emergencies. If you get one, you might want to get the 800 series.

You can download the Silicon Lab Simplicity Studio v5 software for free:

Not critizing HE folks, but if a dongle can remove a ghost why can't the hub do it?

That's a question that's been around for years. I have no first-hand knowledge but from what I've gleaned Hubitat is a z-wave certified consumer device and the stick is a developer tool. The stick is more of a brute-force method that is not available to z-wave certified consumer devices.

Next question, if the device no longer physically exists, but item shows up in the Z-wave list, will the dongle/software remove that from my HE list?

Yup. Though I have found most can be removed without the stick given patience. If it isn't causing you problems you might just wait a couple days and see if it becomes removable. The stick method is a lot more of a hassle and "Simplicity Studio" is not aptly named.

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In most cases, the hub should be able to remove the ghost, but some ghosts are more stubborn than others depending upon what happened in the initial removal process. If you keep trying, you might eventually eliminate the ghost using the hub. If things really got confused, you might not be able to do so, no matter how many times you try.

That is where a second Z-wave radio like the C7 or a USB dongle comes into play. I sense you are getting rather frustrated in dealing with the ghost. Since you do not have a C7 hub, purchasing and using a dongle might be the quickest way of relieving your frustration. The cost of the dongle would be a small price to pay for restoration of your mental well-being as well as the functionality of your home automation system.

If you are really more concerned about the cost of the dongle than you are the value of your time, you can always do a full reset of the Z-wave radio. However, you will have to exclude and re-include every Z-wave device in your mesh. I would not recommend that if you have more than a few Z-wave devices.

First, there are timing issues that automated scripts won't handle well. If you were to get a dongle and the SiLabs software, you'll find you're clicking buttons and watching status messages crawl along the bottom of the screen. The Status messages will tell you when to proceed and that's at least part of the trick. The status may tell you the step didn't work. So you try again, and so on.

Second, the API used by the SiLabs software is the API that was created decades ago that mimics a serial connection. That API is different than the API that gets used by Hubs. Using the serial connection allows the SiLabs software to work with 300, 500, 700 and 800 series USB sticks/dongles.

Third, the SiLabs software with a dongle is strictly a ZWave Radio "fixit tool." Thus it's focused exclusively on getting the in-chip DB adjusted and will not tell the hub much of anything.

The USB Stick/dongle is told, via the SiLabs software to join your hub's mesh identically to any other Zwave device. At that time, the ZWave chip's DB is copied from the Hub to the USB Stick becoming what the ZWave spec calls a Secondary Controller. You then tell the secondary to make adjustments to the DB and the secondary tells the Primary (inside the hub) what successes occurred.

The SiLabs software is, as others have said, a very low level, engineering/developer style of product. It requires more steps to do simple things but because they are broken down into small steps with status indications all along the way, timing is more human speed than automated script speeds.

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And now I have 2 devices messed up. I had one of my Zooz switches quit working, programically. It still worked manually. In the Zwave list I did a refresh. It showed up as pending. So I tried the replace. Put the switch in pairing mode, no luck. Did a factory reset on switch. Turned on the replace again, put switch in pairing mode, no luck. Finally just did a Zwave add and was able to readd the switch. But of course it shows up as a different node. So tried the remove button on the old node. No luck. Did a force remove on the old switch. Switch no longer in devices. But node still in Zwave list. Tried remove again, no luck.

Never have gotten the remove button on the original item.

Hope all this is just coincedence and not something going whacko.