Considering migration

Good morning to all,
This is a first post to the Hubitat forums for me.

Currently, I have a Vera Plus system, with dozens of devices, including binary on/off switches, dimmable switches, DSC alarm panel integration through Envisalink 4, motion sensors (from the alarm panel), garage door opener, Nest Thermostat and Nest Protect integration, Alexa integration, and window blind controllers. For the most part, Vera works well for me, however, their development team seems stagnant, and I'm considering other options. I'd like to be less dependant on the cloud side, so Hubitat offers an attractive altenative.

My questions are as follow to those who have migrated:

  • What were your concerns, and why did you migrate?
  • Has Hubitat addressed the concerns that made you migrate?
  • Are there things you miss about your previous solution?
  • How painful was your migration?
  • How reliable is Hubitat's geofencing? (Vera's is attrocious. Using third part plug-ins offers better support)
  • Are there things you weren't aware of when you migrated that you like, or things you dislike?
  • What is the responsiveness for new devices? (I have GE Jasco motion switches that have been out for 2+ years, and there is no native Vera recognition)

Thanks for any advice you can provide.

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I was a very early adopter of SmartThings. In the early years they did some cool things like live video conferences for developers and they were pretty responsive. After the Samsung buyout it seemed to go downhill . . . or maybe it just went "corporate".

Technically my beef was latency. One of my most important rules is to make sure the front porch lights come on so I can see to unlock the door (it's a mortise lock, so automating it would be a major project). With SmartThings I never knew if it was going to work or how long it might take.

Also, I had phantom lights that would turn on and off for no apparent reason.

I had a couple of simple integrations that I ended up having to write myself. This meant they ran in the cloud and thus were subject to outages.

Lastly, I was sick and tired of Samsung deciding when they were going to push updates and releases (invariably when I was out-of-town) and never knowing whether they would screw something up (they often did).

Hubitat addressed these concerns. My apps now run locally. A couple of months after coming on board, I posted an enhancement request to take care of the automation that was cloud based on SmartThings (I was able to port it to Hubitat but I really wanted to do it within the confines of their built-in and supported apps). The next release of Rule Machine after that request provided the capability I needed (and more).

I don't miss anything about SmartThings. I do like their sensors - their motion and door/window contact sensors are some of the best.

I carefully planned my migration and then, in the midst of day one, I accidentally deleted a whole group of devices from SmartThings. Without a backup I could restore (I didn't mention that, did I?) I decided to just jump in with both feet. I finished the critical devices that day and the rest of the transition the next day.

The biggest pain point was trying to get Z-Wave devices to exclude from SmartThings (this is not their fault, it is the endpoint manufacturers, IMO). GE Z-Wave switches were a pain to exclude until I realized that I had and could use an Aeon Labs Minimote to exclude Z-Wave devices. Also, Sensative Strips door/window sensors are a pain to exclude because they are entirely sealed and you have to learn the pattern to wave the magic magnet to signal them (in lieu of a button press).

I don't use Geofencing.

I was not aware of how far I would end up taking my automation. With SmartThings it was cool to be able to turn things on and off with a smartphone app. The Hubitat Team really lives and breathes the idea of actually automating stuff. It's contagious. Most of the lights in my house now go on and off without any manual intervention. For outdoor lights this is done with a combination of time schedules, lighting (lux) readings, and motion sensors. For indoor lights it is done with a combination of (mostly) motion sensors and door (contact) sensors.

Responsiveness for new devices? Do you mean Hubitat supporting them? I would say they are very good but the community developers are even better (sorry Hubitat). The community comes up with solutions incredibly quickly. The Hubitat Team takes a little longer. Work with Mike Maxwell to get new devices recognized, figure out if they need their own driver or can use an existing one, and get the driver development in queue (if it is needed).

There are glitches. Locks have been a sore point. Some people are experiencing slowness. I don't have the ticket data to tell you percentages. I can say I have had one self-inflicted wound (combined with a sensor that was going bad and I didn't realize it). I have had one hardware failure (the power brick died, I was able to order a replacement from Amazon for next day delivery and less than ten dollars). I had one "crash". Support (BobbyD) suggested I pause the Beta Chromecast app because it appeared to be throwing a large number of errors. I paused it and have not had a problem since (that was about nine months ago).

I don't have an alarm system, I don't have a garage, I don't have any Nest (other than Google Home devices which I believe are now branded Nest) devices, and no Alexa (I have a bunch of Google Home speakers and displays). I have several Graber (Somfy) Z-Wave shades - they work well.

Major releases seem to come every four to six weeks. There are often a handful of follow-up patch releases after a major release. You can choose when to update and you can backup whenever you want. The system retains a small number of backups but also allows you to download them.

Good luck . . . however you decide to proceed!

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Do you have these working in HE then for TTS?

I don't use them much for that because I find the "intro" sound kind of annoying and I have Sonos speakers in almost all the rooms anyway but, yes, it works. What I find odd is I paused (first) then removed the Beta Chromecast app and they still work. I just tested . . . at least from the device page.

During my ongoing z-wave locking I disabled the app and found them still working. But still could be causing issues so have them disabled at the moment...

I disabled the beta Chromecast 8 or 9 months ago. I removed it entirely more recently. I haven't done anything (no changes) with the Google speakers (or displays) and (knock on wood) I have not had any hub issues since disabling the app.

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You doing any reboot schedule?

I reboot after installing a new release. That's about all.

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I reboot because of upgrading. That is all, in the past 6-9 months.

Disclaimer: I do reboot my Development Hubs (2) more often BUT most of that is due to 'swapping' DB. I have one saved backup for "this configuration" and others for "different configs" -- like With and Without HubConnect, With HubConnect as Server, With HubConnect as Remote... and last time I looked, about 5 other configs. :slight_smile:

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I never reboot... Only for updates.. or when I do something stupid (which is why I have a development hub coming in on friday)

You guys have may z-wave device? You on latest hub?

Not sure who that question is to... but I'll answer.. :slight_smile:

My 3 Production Hubs, have the following device mix:

  1. C-4; 52 zwave; 0 zigbee; 103 total devices
  2. C-4; 29 zwave; 21 zigbee; 77 total devices
  3. C-4; 0 zwave; 0 zigbee; 161 total devices

The 3 hubs are interconnected via HubConnect and the 2 with active Z-Radios have devices based on physically dividing the house into Upstairs/Downstairs. The 3rd hub is a 'coordinator' and collects 'everything' so that it can be displayed via Dashboard and sent to other services: primarily Amazon Echo and Apple HomeKit, via Homebridge.

41 Z-Wave devices.

Hubitat Elevation® Platform Version 2.1.8.117

Hardware Version Rev C-4

Here's an off the cuff response for you. I migrated because I wanted to try something different. I was on ST and hated that things had such latency. I'm not a programmer or developer. I am in IT but had no idea what I wanted. I just knew that what I had wasn't working. I was invited to a group and heard about HE there. I jumped in blind because my new found friends told me that I'd love it and that they'd help me get started. So .. JUMP. Two years later, I'm still here. My concerns were latency and down time. Even though we do see it sometimes, my stuff is NEVER down. My migration was easy because I had the community to help. Right out of the box registration wasn't smooth, but @bravenel piped in within 5 minutes of my post and got it fixed. Hub Connect was the best thing next to sliced bread and I was able to migrate things over as I had time and things still worked. My GE switches gave me problems only because ST didn't want to let go of them. Such a pain, but I got them going. Haven't had any trouble with them since. For me, there's nothing to miss in ST because HE is just as, if not more forward thinking than they will ever be. You see, I was around when WebCoRe was a shitshow here and everyone was mad and fighting over it. Even I was.... a bit stressed about it. But, I embraced rule machine and found my zen. I have never been happier with my hub. I am in love with the community. For me, the community is like none other. I've made some great friends here, and I hope you do too. I look forward to seeing you on the other side. Welcome to the rabbit hole. You won't regret jumping in.

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