I have a Hubitat C-8 Pro running platform 2.5.0.159.
For the past several days my Z-Wave network becomes extremely slow or completely unresponsive after the hub has been running for a while.
The Hubitat web UI remains responsive.
Zigbee devices continue working normally.
LAN devices continue working normally.
Only Z-Wave is affected.
Rebooting the hub immediately restores normal Z-Wave operation.
What has already been done
Replaced an older Yale YRD256 with a new Yale YRD430. The old lock had stopped working, and I THOUGHT it might be causing some of the problems (i was wrong)
Successfully excluded and factory reset the lock.
Successfully paired the new lock using S2 Access Control.
Removed two incomplete secure inclusion/orphan nodes using Silicon Labs PC Controller (secondary controller).
Verified no remaining ghost nodes in Z-Wave Details.
Verified new Yale lock is operating normally.
The problem still occurs after the network has been cleaned up.
Current symptoms
When the problem occurs:
Hub UI remains responsive.
Zigbee continues working normally.
Z-Wave devices become extremely slow or non-responsive.
Device commands frequently fail.
Rebooting Hubitat immediately restores operation.
Additional diagnostics
I permanently joined a Silicon Labs UZB as a secondary controller and tested with PC Controller.
During the failure:
PC Controller connects successfully to the controller.
Existing nodes are visible.
Selecting nodes works.
Request Node Info fails on powered Z-Wave devices while the slowdown is occurring.
This suggests the controller remains operational but cannot successfully communicate with network nodes until the hub is rebooted.
Questions
Are there any known issues in 2.5.0.159 that could produce these symptoms?
Would you recommend updating the C-8 Pro Z-Wave firmware from 7.17 to the current available version?
Are there diagnostic logs or radio logs I can capture before rebooting the hub?
Does this behavior indicate a possible Z-Wave controller firmware issue?
What is the purpose of a permanent secondary controller?
FWIW AI says:
The Hubitat Elevation C-8 Prodoes not officially support acting as a Z-Wave secondary controller, nor does it support adding another primary hub as a secondary controller onto its own mesh. [1, 2, 3]
The C-8 Pro utilizes a modern Z-Wave 800-series radio. While the Silicon Labs Z-Wave 800 SDK inherently includes basic secondary controller definitions, the Hubitat platform firmware restricts the hub to acting strictly as the SIS (Stateful Inclusion Server) / Primary Controller of its own mesh network. [1]
If you are trying to expand your network, use multiple hubs, or integrate specific controllers, you must use alternative methods:
It was used to help remove the 2 ghosts i had …..my problem was there long before i used this tool … I had two failed attempts to add a new z-wave door lock that left remnants / ghosts and this was the only way i could get rid of them.
ChatGTP is helping me on this … it says …
I think the post is technically correct about Hubitat hubs, but they are applying it too broadly.
What we did is a standard Silicon Labs maintenance procedure:
Join PC Controller as a secondary controller.
Perform network diagnostics.
Remove failed nodes.
That's exactly what it was designed to do.
In fact, if it weren't supported, we could not have removed Nodes 46 and 123. Yet we did.
Thanks for the reply though - waiting to hear from hubitat staff …. I certainly can remove this z-wave device but my problems were there before I added it ….
Hi Rick - currently BACK to classic z-wave not js…
History - I upgraded to a C8 pro May timeframe. All was fine May thru Junish …
I did several things in July I am thinking one might be causing problems
updated firmware on many of my Zooz z-wave switches (which all seemed to work better after doing).
Added 4 z-wave smartwings roller shades - paired fine - z-wave response when triggering initially fine - later when I tried very slow to respond …
Had a bad / failed yale yrd256 zwave lock - I THOUGHT it might have been the cause as one morning automation I had which unlocks the doors and turns on lights stopped working about a week and a half ago. I removed the unlock command and the automation worked … I think the lock was too chatty and was keeping the z-wave switches from going on.
This weekend, attempted to upgrade to new yale yrd430 z-wave lock. Had a heck of a time getting it to pair up - leading to 2 failed nodes which I had to use silicon studio tools to remove. Eventually got it paired up.
Declared victory after reboot … but then slow to no z-wave response back again last night. zigbee and all other non z-wave stuff fine.
This morning the lights seem …ok … but the shades and the door lock are VERY slow or not responsive at all.
One more item of interest - because my c7 hub has been so recently decommissioned, I powered down my c8, restarted my c7 - just to do a test on joining and unjoining that new lock - it went FAST and quick - and, everything was responsive. No shades on the c7 though those came AFTER I moved to the c8. One option I was thinking of was just a factory reset on the C8 pro - go back to the c7 for a bit … wait a few days - if z-wave perf ok - SLOWLY add over a week or so 1 shade and the new door lock. Or, redo the migration to the c8 pro from scratch and do that same thing. It gives me options …
Remove the controller ghost to start. If anything is using that as a repeater it will slow things down when not installed. That said, make sure the old hub is off. What do your logs/app stats/device stats say about things? You could have a rogue device since you say for a long time it worked fine.
Actually, that is not a GHOST - I had left the controller on there from when I was doing ACTUAL ghost removal. I should just be able to unjoin it and I will do that now. Then we can come back to logs …
That's not a problem, and it isn't causing the issues you're experiencing either. There are no ghosts or stranded nodes on C-8 Pro.
Can you check the z-wave logs to see if you have any spammy devices? Or devices with frequent power reporting. Spammy/noisy devices or frequent power reporting will jam up the controller and introduce random delays and a general lack of responsiveness.
You need to look at the z-wave logs. Not the hub logs. Then copy/paste the logs into something like Gemini and/or Claude - they'll help you decode what the logs indicate and if the frequency of reporting is too high.
To get the z-wave logs, click on the "View logs" button on the z-wave settings page.
When you remove the physical controller from power it becomes a ghost. If anything tries to route through it will slow down. That’s why I would remove it when I removed ghosts that way.
Thanks Rick - i did a z-wave exclude and it’s gone. I rebooted after. That was a couple hrs ago … z-wave response on lights was ok after reboot, 4 shades and lock - iffy / not. Right now - lights are again non responsive …. here is most recent live log
OK sounds like you are making progress. Not clear to me how a secondary controller (PC/Silicon Labs s/w and a ZWave stick) cleans up a corrupt database in Hubitat that is the root of the ghost nodes. That would seem to be better handled by some utility on the offending hub, i.e. Hubitat. I have used Silicon Labs s/w and ZWave stick to flash a device I was having trouble with from the Hubitat flashing tool but haven’t done much more than that.
I had some ghost issues when I first migrated a bunch of devices from Vera to Hubitat. In the end I had to switch to JS from ZIP as JS was far superior at cleaning ghost nodes. I have swapped back and forth a few times since then (JS/ZIP but for other reasons) and it is stable.
Yes - it’s a tool for doing stuff with z-wave and there are several threads on this forum how to use it. I first bought it and used it with my c7 hub about 18 months back - removed 2 stubborn ghosts back then. This time I used it to remove 2 failed attempts at adding a new z-wave lock where it PARTIALLY joined ….
Did you capture those Z-wave logs like aaiyar said above? Let the hub run for a while with the Z-wave logging on, and preferably in a new tab or window. Copy and paste those into an AI assistant, and tell it that you are having slowdowns and lockups. Ask it to analyze those logs, and tell you if there is something that might be causing issues.
Take the AI statement with a grain of salt, but they can help to narrow things down. I had one spammy device on Zigbee, and it detected that for me. I wasn't having any obvious issues, I was just doing it as an experiment, but it truly found a device that I needed to tone down.
