"Best" Lighting Solution

csteele - Excellent, thanks!

Not many toggle style I see. Insteon still makes them and the GE/Jasco.

I'm a fan of Insteon, very good quality, but you have some integration challenges with it since there's no official HE support. I run a Node.js server to control mine, and while it works very well, I know that solution isn't for everyone. There is a direct HTTP driver for Insteon that @cwwilson08 created by modifying @ogiewon 's HTTP driver, but it has to be used sparingly I found. I had issues when I tried to refresh to keep the physical switches in sync.

One word of caution... If you do find a 'New Old Stock" of the Caseta SmartBridge Pro (not Pro2), you may have trouble getting it to work at all. Lutron made some mandatory firmware changes to the original 'Pro' version. However, if yours has not already received that update, it never will. Lutron will stand behind their product and replace it for you...however it is just simpler to buy a Pro2 to be sure you get a working model. Energy Avenue has decent prices and fairly quick shipping for Lutron Caseta devices, including the Pro2 bridge and Pico remotes.

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Actually, if you buy a "PRO" hub you won't be able to activate it any more. But Lutron will replace it with a Pro2 for free. Multiple posts on the forum of folks having to do that. Some have bought the pro since its cheaper and swapped it for a pro2 but if you want simple, just get the pro2.

Is there an echo in here? :wink:

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Damn it! I started writing that before you posted, then got caught up talking with Bruce in another tab and came back and just finished it and hit post. Great minds think alike I guess. :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye: :clown_face:

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Seems to me this is a very slippery slope. With Lutron using their own wireless frequencies and protocols, I will weaken my Z-Wave and Zigbee networks if/when I replace existing devices with Lutron. Also, since I will have to convert to Decora style plates, it sort of forces me to replace all the switches and all the receptacles if I want to stay consistent (feel free to let me know about my OCD tendencies). That's really more than I want to take on.

The Zooz switches allow me to keep a "plain" switch on the three-way circuits (and I believe there are others with the same wiring design), they are available in an old style toggle (as are the GE/Jasco) so the appearance will be fairly consistent. The dimmer slider is a little different from my current dimmer switches . . .

I've had good luck with the Zooz pieces so far - is there another brand I should be looking at? I'm leaning that way (I probably won't do anything until late January so I can think about it some more) . . .

Not really possible.
Lutron is 433mhz
ZWave is 908mhz
Zigbee is 2.4ghz

However, they are all "license free communication devices" frequencies. Meaning your garage door opener could cause more interference than the rest of your HA system. :slight_smile:

I think he means by replace active z-wave routers with Lutron leaving dead spots. Not RF interference.

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Oh.. that's a foreign thought to me :smiley: :smiley: retiring a working ZWave device?? Never crossed my mind!!

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Yes, that's what I meant. I have GE Z-Wave switches in the carport, by the front door, and by the back doors. Those are all areas where (I think) I benefit from the repeater capability. If I change those out for Lutron switches, I am worried I might need to put something else in to serve as a repeater in those areas.

Why replace those? Just use Lutron on the additional lights your wife want to automate. I have mix of device all controlled by HE, zwave, zigbee, Lutron, Hue, network. Spread the love, spread the bandwidth :slight_smile:

I am worried about all the different styles of switches. I don't think the WAF will be very high if we have different kinds of switches that work differently scattered around the house. I would think it would complicate management and trouble-shooting (although maybe this wouldn't be a big deal).

And it would probably set my OCD instincts off from the aesthetic aspect . . .

I was a little worried about this originally as well. In my case, for some inexplicable reason, my wife hasn't complained at all about a combination of traditional toggle switches and newer decora style switches. When I do add a smart decora style switch to a box, I replace all of the dumb switches with new inexpensive dumb decora switches as well. I am also slowly switching the house from old almond switches to white switches (which she prefers!). The Lutron Pico's fit right in with the decora switches, which she prefers to handheld remotes or touchscreens.

If you survey the smart switch market, decora style really is where the momentum is in the USA. No reason to fight against the mainstream. :slight_smile:

Not suffering from OCD, I can empathize, but sorry I cannot relate.
However, you may want to factor in eventual resale value of your home. Having a reliable home automation system already installed is good for boosting the sale value of your home.

Having a Z-Wave system that needs repeaters and babying will be a headache for the new owner. Imagine your OCD with the image of the new owner throwing all those relatively new Z-Wave outlets in the trash to put in plain old Decora style on/off switches because they don't like the older toggle style switches.

Now imagine the excitement from the agents selling your home someday with trouble-free modern Lutron CesΓ©ta switches that the new owner will never even consider replacing because they are stylish and just work.

You must be in sales . . . :slight_smile:

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Aren't we all? DId you not have to "Sell" your wife on the smart home or was she pushing you to automate what was once a simple light switch? :wink:

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I can just feel the jinx coming on but . . .

I follow your point. One of the big selling points is (I think) that Lutron Caseta is more likely to be supported by a professional electrician that whatever I cobble together with Hubitat, Google Home, Z-Wave, Zigbee, etc. While I don't care about that, I think that would be of value to another homeowner.

I have not had problems with devices "falling off the network", either Zigbee or Z-Wave. The only time I have had to "mess" with devices is when I switched from SmartThings to Hubitat. On SmartThings I did have devices randomly turning on and off from time to time but I just attributed that to demonic possession. Also, I won't be able to get rid of the Zigbee and/or Z-Wave devices - I will still have door/window sensors, motion sensors, water sensors, etc. So I still need to make sure those respective networks are operational as they are an integral part of the automation.

I would think, if most of my wall switches were Z-Wave, that would result in a pretty strong mesh . . . are others finding that isn't true?

I want to apologize for occasionally talking (or posting) in circles. I want to thank you all for the suggestions, comments and discussion. I really needed this to help me think it through (and I'm still not there yet, as you may be able to see).

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The key to a smart home system that the average home buyer wants is the KISS principal.

  • Security
  • Alexa and/or Google Home
  • HomeKit/Siri
  • 99% trouble-free lights

If, or when I sell this house someday, most of this stuff will come out depending on where we are with automation technology at that point. I will probably leave behind the Lutron Connected Bulb Remotes, because they just need a new battery every 3 years. They're otherwise worry free unless you change the bulb they're paired to, but I would just leave the relatively simple procedure to reset and re-pair them with the new owner.

All Insteon will be removed unless there is an integrated HE solution at the time of sale. Hue and/or Lution will remain and I will install the home automation gear in a proper RF transparent in-wall cabinet. The chances of the next buyer wanting to ever re-pair or re-join a device is slim to none.

My alarm system will stay with the house because it uses its own proprietary sensors and they never need re-pairing, just batteries.

One thing to consider with caseta dimmers and switches (and picos) is it is obvious what to do, top button on, bottom button off. Middle up and down dim up and down.

Having sold a couple houses, watching people not understand "smart dimmers" led me down the path to caseta. It just works.

Next to toggles, it also makes sense considering they aren't really decora rocker switches, but 2-5 button controllers.

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